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Anyone got SIM Access Profile (SAP) working with MMI?


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Currently I have a BB Pearl 8110 and connect using Handsfree profile on Bluetooth to the MMI 3G in my car. It works quite well.

As I understand it the new SAP profile (under Bluetooth) enables direct SMS messaging via the screen in the car and also more importantly puts the phone in low power mode and uses the in car antennae to boost reception and subsequently increases the battery life on the phone. Effectively you have put the phone SIM in the MMI, without actually taking it out of the phone!

Am wondering anyone is using SAP profile and if its worth the bother to try and get SAP profile working with a BlackBerry Curve 8900 (I have the option to upgrade)? I tried it with a colleague's BB Bold 9000 this week and it connected fine using Handsfree (got the address book and everything) but it was choking when I tried to connect via the "Car Phone" profile (which I assume was the MMI's way of saying SAP profile).

I have read elsewhere that the Audi BT phone prep in MMI works quite nicely with Nokia's (especially SAP profile) but not read that you can do this conclusively with BlackBerry (which is the corporate standard at my work).

Any hints or tips would be welcome.

Sean

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From what I have read about your car, you have MMI 3G. When I tested my Nokia 5800 music express on 3G the phone system was awesome. It makes me want it even more now in my S8.

As for the BB's all the latest BB's now support rSAP with version 4.7. I tested my mates Bold against my 2G rSAP connection and it connected ok, but we could not get the contacts from the phone book. Which we could do with the Nokia after downloading an app to it. I suspect my colleague didn't have any contacts on his SIM or his phone was not setup correctly for phone book access. But we were driving back from Dublin at the time and it was late.

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I can confirm that both SIM Access Profile (in MMI terminology `Car Phone' profile) and Handsfree profiles on a BlackBerry Curve 8900 work with MMI (3G) out of the box. In SAP profile the MMI in-built phone pulls the address book details from the BB memory (I have no contacts stored on the SIM), which was a concern I had.

After the initial pairing is done (you have to pair once for SAP mode and once for Handsfree mode) the setup remembers the last profile you were connected on and reconnects using that profile by default.

In case anyone is interested the phone is running v4.6.1.133 firmware (out of the box) and the MMI (so i'm reliably told) is running the factory installed v0007.

The Audi site reports that only the BB Bold 9000 has been tested as working but I suspect this may be a few months out of date.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi guys,

I've been reading your post and you seem to be talking about issues relevant to problems that i am currently experiencing.

First time i connected my Bold it connected with SAP profile and disconnected itself after about 2 minutes.

Now whenever i connect it, it only connects with Handsfree profile.

I don't seem to be able to make it use SAP anymore.

Seansimpson mentions in his post that you need to connect once with Handsfree and again with SAP.

Please could someone explain the process of how to do this as it has been driving me mad.

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My two penneth worth...I defer to Craigyb for real expert advice here :)

1. Delete the existing phone pairing in the bluetooth devices list within MMI

2. Pair using Handsfree profile - enter the 4 digit PIN.

3. Pair using Carphone (SAP) profile - enter the 16 digit PIN

On my Curve a message on the screen confirms the phone is connected using SAP profile. The only option in this mode is a big "OK" to disconnect from SAP and release the blackberry back to normal.

I was pleasantly surprised when in SAP mode I was could send/receive calls with "address book functionality" - because I have no contacts at all stored on the SIM, they are solely in the blackberry itself (which is synced with my office Outlook/Exchange account). Hence my own theory that you need to pair using Handsfree (do step 2. above) to get the address book to transfer - through some bluetooth obex function :confused:?? However I could be totally wrong and MMI and the Curve are clever enough to pull name/address details on the fly in pure SAP mode, hence you would only need to pair using SAP mode. Hope that makes sense?

I didn't really read the manual, just played around and it all worked. Only ever had to do the pairing process the once in Handsfree and Carphone (SAP) mode.

Hi guys,

I've been reading your post and you seem to be talking about issues relevant to problems that i am currently experiencing.

First time i connected my Bold it connected with SAP profile and disconnected itself after about 2 minutes.

Now whenever i connect it, it only connects with Handsfree profile.

I don't seem to be able to make it use SAP anymore.

Seansimpson mentions in his post that you need to connect once with Handsfree and again with SAP.

Please could someone explain the process of how to do this as it has been driving me mad.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi guys just thought I would get you an update.

I decided to give up on trying to get the Blackberry Bold working with my A5, and I have bought a Nokia E71 which seems to work very well now I have install the Nokia contacts downloader on it.

My only slight problem now is that if I receive a text message while in the car, I can read it on the car system but when i then get out of the car the text stays in the car and is not transfered to the phone.

Does anyone know if this is normal? and is it possible to transfer messages from the car back to the phone?

Also thanks to seansimpson, your post was very helpful and I did get the Blackberry connected to my car but decided to get the Nokia as other people were sucessfully using it with their A5's.

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My only slight problem now is that if I receive a text message while in the car, I can read it on the car system but when i then get out of the car the text stays in the car and is not transfered to the phone.

Does anyone know if this is normal? and is it possible to transfer messages from the car back to the phone?

From what i have read on this forum by other members this is normal and a limitation of rSAP support with MMI.

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My only slight problem now is that if I receive a text message while in the car, I can read it on the car system but when i then get out of the car the text stays in the car and is not transfered to the phone.

Does anyone know if this is normal? and is it possible to transfer messages from the car back to the phone?

That's normal.

The reason it happens is that rSap is actually a phone that just "uses" your SIM card for contact and network access purposes. So text messages received while in the car are stored in the "phone" in the car and not in the SIM, so they're not in your phone when you leave the car.

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  • 3 weeks later...
That's normal.

The reason it happens is that rSap is actually a phone that just "uses" your SIM card for contact and network access purposes. So text messages received while in the car are stored in the "phone" in the car and not in the SIM, so they're not in your phone when you leave the car.

Actually, it might also depend on the phone. My Nokia 6500 Classic does this in the RS 6 (2G MMI), where if I get an SMS message, I can't read it once I've left the car.

However, much to my surprise, when I jumped into the S5 (3G MMI), there were all the SMS messages I received in the RS 6! So, they're in the phone, not the car, it's just that the phone can't read them.

I figured out in the end that Nokia decided to use the phone's built-in memory to store SMS messages, so didn't bother to put in the ability to read messages from the SIM. Because rSAP is "SIM Access" it naturally stores the received message in the SIM.

So I see it as more of a Nokia fault, not that complaining to them will do much I suspect.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hi there - similar issue - apologies if this the wrong thread. If you prefer me to start a new one please ask.

I have a A6 58 plate (pre face lift) with full MMI High and Sat Nav DVD, along with phone prep high etc.

I have a Nokia 5800, which for some reason i cant get to read contacts from the phone, only the SIM, even though it is fully connected using the rSAP. I know this because i can receive SMS to the car (even though you cant reply - lol)

2 questions -

1 - anyone know of way to make this work?

2 - How do i check my "software" versions of MMI and NAV etc to see if i have the latest, and if so, where do i find the latest version of the Audi software?

Many thanks

Graham

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You need a contacts download manager on your 5800, in HFP it works, but for some reason in rSAP mode it doesn't.

The Nokia 810 contacts download manager will not work, I think I installed the Nokia 616 download manager on my 5800 when I had the 2G rSAP system like yours. They seem to have fixed it with the 3G rSAP system.

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  • 1 month later...

I'm having an interesting 'experience' with my High Prep phone sytem and rSAP. Initially the salesman and I set up rSAP with my Touch HD and it worked perfectly for 3 months with full contact transfer (SIM only) though it took several attempts to get it going. I then lost my phone and paired up another Touch HD with a replacement SIM..again worked fine...for two weeks before I added a couple of mumbers (still only 62 total) then it started disconnecting during phonebook transfer. Tried all the 'delete all BT devices' start all the pairing again, delete the extra entries from the SIM etc and nothing worked except simple BT handsfree with no phonebook. Got my original phone back(lucky me!) and had them cancel the new SIM and reinstate the original one...so I was back to exactly what had worked for 3 months, wouldn't do RSAP though, BT only and only two (!) phonebook entries got transferred.

Tried another phone, Nokia E71 with the same SIM, still failed. Tried that with a 3 SIM. In HFree mode it worked, in rSAP mode it crashed the MMI phone module! (the unit sudDenly said 'Phone is off.....phone is on' when you started the process)

Back to dealer time. They paired up three phones in HF and rSAP mode in the morning (Sony, HTC and Nokia) and then deleted them all when I arrived to show me that they all worked when they re-paired them ..except they didn't..not one of them! I did however get my Touch HD to re-pair in HF/no phonebook mode and it works fine. No rSAP still though.

The Technician and I both came to the same possible cause..that the MMI/Phone unit is somehow corrupting some NV memory in rSAP mode depending on the phone/SIM/SIM PB contents and once that happens.. kiss your reliable rSAP pairing goodbye. Not very robust firmware. He's filed a fault report and I'll post when he gets an answer.

They've ordered me a new module now to try that but I'm not holding my breath for a reliable working solution..the Audi rSAP implementation looks pretty buggy to me. Anyone know how to 'really factory reboot' a DVD based MMI system? I have a suspicion that might work for a while at least..it did before!

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I'm having an interesting 'experience' with my High Prep phone sytem and rSAP. Initially the salesman and I set up rSAP with my Touch HD and it worked perfectly for 3 months with full contact transfer (SIM only) though it took several attempts to get it going. I then lost my phone and paired up another Touch HD with a replacement SIM..again worked fine...for two weeks before I added a couple of mumbers (still only 62 total) then it started disconnecting during phonebook transfer. Tried all the 'delete all BT devices' start all the pairing again, delete the extra entries from the SIM etc and nothing worked except simple BT handsfree with no phonebook. Got my original phone back(lucky me!) and had them cancel the new SIM and reinstate the original one...so I was back to exactly what had worked for 3 months, wouldn't do RSAP though, BT only and only two (!) phonebook entries got transferred.

Tried another phone, Nokia E71 with the same SIM, still failed. Tried that with a 3 SIM. In HFree mode it worked, in rSAP mode it crashed the MMI phone module! (the unit sudDenly said 'Phone is off.....phone is on' when you started the process)

Back to dealer time. They paired up three phones in HF and rSAP mode in the morning (Sony, HTC and Nokia) and then deleted them all when I arrived to show me that they all worked when they re-paired them ..except they didn't..not one of them! I did however get my Touch HD to re-pair in HF/no phonebook mode and it works fine. No rSAP still though.

The Technician and I both came to the same possible cause..that the MMI/Phone unit is somehow corrupting some NV memory in rSAP mode depending on the phone/SIM/SIM PB contents and once that happens.. kiss your reliable rSAP pairing goodbye. Not very robust firmware. He's filed a fault report and I'll post when he gets an answer.

They've ordered me a new module now to try that but I'm not holding my breath for a reliable working solution..the Audi rSAP implementation looks pretty buggy to me. Anyone know how to 'really factory reboot' a DVD based MMI system? I have a suspicion that might work for a while at least..it did before!

Things move on.. the HTC Touch HD is now pairing and transferring the full SIM phone book every time...but the signal strength display is 'struck through' and the MMI just reports a network problem when you try to call...one step forward, two steps back. Sigh!

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  • 1 year later...

craigyb

Sorry to ask but a lot of threads have pointed me to you who could potentially help?

I have just purchased a 58 plate A8 Quattro Sport 3.0 TDI and am having lots of problems pairing my Blackberry torch with the MMI? Have you any ideas on the right order or settings to use to get it to work and I have managed it only twice in about 20 attemps but immediately as it connects it asks to disconnect with some reference to SAP ?

Any help is much appreciated

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Never paired a torch to a 2G rSAP system. But Bascially you do the following.

First of all, delete all pairings from the car and the phone that relate to each other. so Audi BTA from the phone and the BB from the car.

Restart your phone to make sure it has gone and you are starting fresh.

Make sure your ignition key is out of the cars barrel.

Make sure remote sim mode is set to "ON" on the Torch and the phone is set to visible.

Turn the ignition on your car on so that the dash lights up

Search from your car for a mobile phone.

When it finds the Torch, select it.

Accept the 16 digit code and then enter that on the torch.

The phone should now pair with the car in rSAP mode

Set the AUDI BTA device to be trusted on the Torch in the device properties.

That should be it.

You may want to get Audi to update your MMI to the latest revision to update the BTA module to the latest firmware for compatibilty. The way to tell if you have the latest or not is this. If the 16 digit code is all random numbers then it is old, if it is 4 groups of uniform numbers , then it is upto date.

7657 3443 1243 9001 = old firmware in the BTA module

1111 3333 7777 2222 = latest firmware in the BTA module

Edited by craigyb
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Im not being funny but i wish they would just ditch this rSAP technology its a real ball ache for us tec's. It is crap i call it crap SAP. I just wish you could just connect phone via bluetooth and thats your lot........job done!!!! I think the new FlexRay system used on the new Touareg eliminates all of this ball ache. I know its VW guys and gals but ill keep you posted

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