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DHA
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From the way Steve Jobs made out the iPhone IPS screen tech is better than OLED tech (which is bs in my opinion)

Riz, you're off again spouting half truths again :P

The screen is absolutely killer on the '4. There ain't a phone that comes near it. As for the lawsuits, it's the same company that ALWAYS files lawsuits against Apple. The last one was for the edges on the MBPs being too sharp for example. It's a money making scam. One that's been quite successful with Apple settling a number of them. It happens to Microsoft too - hell they had to remove some benign code from Office because of one such scam 'suing'.

As for the signal issue, I agree with that. I've been through a number of the units and I'm back using my 3GS, I just didn't get on with the phone signal problem. Maybe the updates will sort it, who knows. Official standpoint is here: Letter from Apple Regarding iPhone 4

The more popular a product gets the more 'big deal' problems can appear. Just look at Microsoft. Apple's high marketing strategy bites them in the ass when something goes wrong - but do you really think everyone who has a '4 has the signal problem? Come on.

Also, look at the penetration of the products:

152826-admob_may_2010_android_ios_500.jpg

This is iPhone not including the 4 - imagine what it looks like now? Of course problems will come to the front when the product gets so much press and so much exposure.

I am bloody annoyed though about the signal problem - it was a pain in the ass for me. Two swap outs, tried numerous units in shop, finally got the rage and gave it back.

Edited by Mac
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I've been thinking about this some more. It's interesting what Apple has achieved since about 2006. Back then they were the outsider and underdog, and god people love an underdog don't they?

They start to get things right, and then people start gunning for them. It's almost as if they're the new Axis of Evil.

I don't really get it. Every tech company has problems with software & devices, and it's usually the one in the spotlight at the time that gets it in the neck isn't it?

Using somebody else's failure to justify your own purchase as being 'better' is understandable in some ways. I couldn't operate with the iPhone 4's I've had. They didn't work well enough.

I went back to the 3GS - there isn't a single Android unit I've come across that even comes close to the 3GS for me. A lot of people seem to agree.

Apple will sort this problem out - obviously. Whether it's a recall or software update - I remain to be convinced. It hasn't done them any good though has it?

Do I think they're the new Evil Empire? No, I don't. They've refreshed a market and their products continue to be way ahead of the competition. Hell I work for the competition :grin:

It's interesting to see in my travels the mix of phones by the way. You see iPhones simply everywhere, in Cisco, at Microsoft, at loads of the big tech vendors. These people are knowledgeable about technology, it's their livelyhood. Yet the way people talk you'd think they just bought something cos it was cool over functionality. Give these people some credit :rolleyes:

It's the same with laptops - I use a high end Macbook pro. High end as in about 3k+ worth. I use it because it's the best piece of hardware I can find for my use, and in budget. If my budget was 500 quid I'd probably have a different opinion wouldn't I? Of course.

This reminds me of the whole CBM64 vs Spectrum thing you used to hear. I bet Riz would have been a Speccy user :grin:

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You said it earlier, it's the same old story of a company becoming very succesful (a la Microsoft) and the critics come out and batter anything they do (a la Microsoft).

They make big financial announcements (a la Microsoft), are accused of bringing upgrades out for the sake of it with little improvement to the end user (a la Microsoft) and then they bring out something with obvious release flaws (a la Microsoft and Vista) and the vultures are hovering.

They get sued for everything and anything (a la Microsoft and Sun) and before you know it they're accused of stealing things (hello Nokia). Next, they're up in front of the senate for creating a monopoly (a la Waddingtons) and everyone wants to see them fail.

Eventually, the heat fades because someone else pops up with a neat idea (a la Still Waiting) and they'll get big and become the next victim (a la Microsoft, a la Apple).

Cyclical criticism, little more. They've done lots wrong, but they've done a lot more right. Personally I'm over the moon we have Microsoft, Apple and a few others (not so chuffed with Google cos I think they're the biggest threat of all to anything remotely competitive) and just hope they continue driving things to the end user for many many years to come.

p.s. have a look at Piel Frama cases. I've just ordered one for my iPhone 4 and one for the iPad. Look lovely.

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Aye, I agree.

Personally I can't stand google's ethics. Don't be evil? Ridiculous. They're busying your data - you'd have to be insane to house your company data with them. Azure is a different matter, I've seen how that works, and it really isn't evil. Even the agreement terms aren't evil.

Back on the iP4 bit, amazing how journalists can take a simply written admittance of a problem and rewrite it in a way to make it sound even worse: Embarrassed Apple admits iPhone exaggerates signal - News, Gadgets & Tech - The Independent

The problem has always existed :D Idiots.

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Incidentally, have a look at this showing actual signal strength on the units:

074258-signal.jpg

I suppose this could hold sway on the software fix for the issue :confused: I've never experienced the issue with the 3GS or the G.

Why can't I read that without laughing at "cupping tightly". :roflmao:

The child like immaturity of a 41 year old can be amazing at times.

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I think we need a little balance in this discussion.

The previous iPhone's have been excellent in relation to software but poor in relation to hardware of which much of that is addressed in the iPhone 4 but has take an generation or two to catch up to features that were offered on phones 5 years ago.

Its camera is much improved, it can now capture reasonable video and the screen is up there with the very very best. But its still not perfect, no user addable memory or replaceable battery for a start and they are still far to protective over some of the applications that aren't approved for the phones or iPads.

When any company starts to become dominant people want to attack them and find a weakness so they need to be whiter than white and to a large extent Apple have done this. They offer a premium product for those that want to pay the extra for the perceived extra quality, but as has been found with the signal issue it doesn't take much to tarnish the image having to deal with problems in what is meant to be a higher quality product.

I've got a 3G and I'm sure I will get an iPhone 4 when my contract is up in a few weeks, but some of these issues have made me questions if a 3GS is 80% of the product for half the price and with fewer issues. They techy in my will override most of that head over heart discussion but for many others it won't.

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But what does that have to do with Android :confused:

It'll be fixed, so what? Android can't even keep up with the previous generation product so far.

I really don't see your point Riz?

I didnt say it had anything to do with Android nor did I mention Android in my previous post, I was just posting my opinion about the iPhone 4 in what is a iPhone 4 releated thread. :rolleyes: Infact I think it was you who brought Anroid into this.

Its funny how if we rewind back a few weeks we saw how individuals were saying the iPhone 4 and iOS4 was the best thing since slice bread before it was even released...... :roflmao:I call those individuals sheep.... even now some people think Apple will fix the reception problems..... :rolleyes:

This topic has nothing to do with Android so lets keep ontopic about the iPhone 4, the iOS4 and Apple`s mamouth c0ck up!

Anybody think Apple will recall/replace the iPhone4 or actually go ahead with this update to cover up the reception problems?

I have already heard that they wont be offering free bumper cases?

Riz :rolleyes:

Edited by Riz
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Riz get a grip. You think Apple *won't* fix the problems? Really? Come on, that's not reality.

The problem will be fixed - and my opinion still stands. There ain't another phone that comes near the 3GS or the '4 when it finally works as expected.

I doubt they'll offer free cases. I'd be surprised if the software updated doesn't fix the actual issue - however for you to understand *why* I'm saying that Riz you'd need some understanding of the tech.

There are potentially two separate issues here. There's actual signal issues - I.e. can't make a call/receive etc. - and there's the phone reporting no signal.

My experience has been with limited signal when held in a certain way. Apple are saying it's a software fix - who knows, it could just be that easy. Who's to say the reporting of the signal strength interferes with your ability to make a call?

To say Apple have a problem that they can't fix is simply ridiculous. It'll be fixed and forgotten about. Much like the rebooting Nokias, ridiculous Windows mobile problems etc. It's just one of those things that happens with tech.

I'd put money on it happening soon.

Like I say, I still don't think there's a real competitor out there to the 3GS, never mind the 4 once it's right.

It bores the tits off me when people look for problems with stuff that companies have done just to bolster their own purchase choices. Now, to stop that being thrown back at me - I rarely purchase my tech stuff myself and cos of that I have pretty much free reign on what to use.

Personally I want Android/Symbian/Whoever to get brilliant and to start innovating rather than following - that way Apple will have to pick their game up too. Getting a leg-up cos another provider has been an error is hardly a great way to run a tech business is it?

Edited by Mac
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Just to qualify what I mean on the reporting/actual signal - consider a problem Cisco had with the firmware on some of their 7941 IPT deskphones.

The units would 'ask' a management system for the quality of the call. Now, a problem developed with the management system which resulted in the reporting of closed call admission (I.e Call Admission Control).

The effect was that the Cisco phone couldn't make a call because it had been told it couldn't due to admission control - in the context of the '4 this would be the 'can't make a call cos poor signal is being reported'.

The investigation on the actual signal production would seem to indicate this is what's happening:

074258-signal.jpg

From reading through all the tech articles on the '4s problem it would appear that the problem is similar according to Apple - the phone is reporting poor signal therefore deciding it can't make a call.

Hopefully that will turn out to be the case? Hopefully for Apple anyways :grin:

Just masking the signal problem wouldn't be a resolution - you're not really interested in the number of bars reported are you, you're interested in being able to make/receive calls at a good quality, and getting good data speeds.

Edited by Mac
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With regards to the iPhone not having user 'addable' memory, why does it need it? Is 16 or 32gb not enough for a phone...

HTC or some other which only come with 512mb drives need expansion slots that can take upto 32gb to be on level terms.

The Nokia N97 I think is one of the few that has a 32gb internal drive and expansion slot but I could be wrong, but it's a phone why need so much ???

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I have a 3GS and no other phone comes close to it... can't imagine ever moving away from an iPhone, the competition would really need to bring something groundbreaking out! Glad I get a Blackberry for work though, I wouldn't want to use an iPhone for work!

I have to say though that the iPhone is not actually a great phone, I often don't have a signal when my BB has half and sometimes people can't hear me that well... but it makes up for this in all other areas.

Not sure I look the look of the new iPhone 4 yet though :P

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With regards to the iPhone not having user 'addable' memory, why does it need it? Is 16 or 32gb not enough for a phone...

HTC or some other which only come with 512mb drives need expansion slots that can take upto 32gb to be on level terms.

The Nokia N97 I think is one of the few that has a 32gb internal drive and expansion slot but I could be wrong, but it's a phone why need so much ???

Its not just a phone is it that's the whole point, people want to put as much music on it as they can or as many photos and now its recording 720p video that memory is going to fill up pretty quickly.

So on most other smart phones you can just add another little SD card and you are away again, with the iPhone thats it your done you have to either delete something or wait until you can get home or to another device.

I wasn't pointing this out to be fickle it was for a valid reason. +++

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