Soulboy

Froch v Groves

51 posts in this topic

Probably the biggest fight for UK boxing in decades.

I rate both of them, so would like to see it go to distance and the best man get the decision.

But there is a lot of needle - so I just hope nobody gets hurt..........you know what I mean. The Watson/Mclellan/Stone era put me (and many others) off pro boxing for years.

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I guess it depends what you mean by "I rate both of them".

 

I don't rate either of them on a truly world class scale.  Froch was badly exposed by Ward (who is world class), Groves has a lack of discipline (should have won the first fight after the start he had) and neither of them are little more than very good fighters.

 

I would love to see Groves win.  I have probably always underestimated him, but I can't see him beating Froch.

 

I really don't like Froch.  Ever since he bad-mouthed Calzaghe years ago he hasn't learned how to act with any amount of decorum.  He has also been incredibly lucky in his career.  Taylor should have beaten him.  It could be argued he lost against Dirrell and his victory against Abraham just proved what an over-rated boxer Abraham was in my opinion.

 

Only in his fights against Kessler has he really entertained, and he mouths off about those wins as if it is career defining.  It isn't.  This is a man who Calzaghe was boxing the head off over 7 years ago when he was in his prime.

 

Ringside monitoring is on a completely different level to that of the 80's and 90's.  I don't have any real concerns about that in this fight.  What happened back then was more due to medical provision and poor refereeing then it was anything else.  All the boxers you mention were victims of the governance of the sport rather than the in-ring action.  All should have been stopped beforehand.

 

I don't agree it is the biggest fight for UK boxing for decades either.  If you're talking about Britain v Britain, maybe, but both Hatton v Mayweather, Hatton v Pacquiao, Calzaghe v Hopkins, etc were all much bigger fights in the scheme of things.

 

If I had my ideal result then I'd like to see Groves KO Froch within 5 rounds.  But that is unlikely.

 

Instead I see Froch stopping Groves in 10-11 rounds, maybe even a last round stoppage.

 

Groves ties up badly in the last 3 rounds and everyone knows that is when Froch is at his best.

 

I think both possess limited boxing skill.  Froch has the benefit of a granite jaw.  Groves has the benefit of real aggression from the start (possibly one of the best starters of recent years).

 

I think of big fights as being multi-world title bouts or fights that will mean that opportunity opens up.  Unfortunately the only person this fight opens up a fight with is Andre Ward.  He's already massacred Froch in child-like schooling fashion and he'd do the same against Groves.  At least Groves would have a go at him though.

 

So for me it is a one-off grudge match with little value beyond the final bell.

 

I'm looking forward to it though purely because it is set to explode from the first punch thrown.

Edited by NewNiceMrMe

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A bit of a harsh critique of both boxers there NNMM?

 

Agreed Calzaghe was the best of his generation, I was at ringside in Manchester to watch some of the finest rounds of "Schooling" I have ever seen when he fought Lacy

 

I dont agree with Ward doing the same to Froch, as Ward was hanging on for the last couple of rounds and he never "Dominated" Froch at any point in that fight, yes he out boxed him at some points of the contest, but to say he was schooled him, is stretching it somewhat

 

I also do get amused by armchair pundits who have never got into a ring and done a few rounds, of any type of full contact sport, particularly boxing.

 

Please note:

 

You do not become a WBC WBA IBF Boxing World Champion and defend and retain that title by luck or not having the skill & ability to fight at the highest level

 

Groves trash talking in this regard just demeans the whole sport, and let me guess......... if and when he wins a World title he is going to turn round and say;

 

"Everyone I fought to get this  World title was utter cr4p"

 

I dont mind the trash talking, up to a point, but trying  to demean the actual sport by questioning a fighters World Championship record  is crossing the line IMO, and for that reason Groves needs beating tonight just for that if nothing else, as his complete lack of respect and attitude with this particular line of trash, does actually stink

 

Froch reasonable boxing ability but the ultimate "Bare knuckle" mentality and constitution

 

Groves again IMO reasonable boxing ability and fast hand speed, but take a look at his style and you will see it is totally and utterly predictable, long crouched stance, rifle left jab, right hand cocked, anyone with good feet and lateral movement is going to beat him, as he does not have some large repertoire of shots that someone like Ward or even Kessler for instance possess, those two would whip him IMO

 

Froch on the other hand is tailor made for him, and makes him look better than he actually is, as he has basically zero lateral movement and no defence worth a w4nk from an overhand right

 

As for the first fight, the best analysis I have heard was from Virgil Hunter:

 

The Guy was beaten, fell forward gloves literally on the floor and head down into the refs arms, he was gone, to claim anything else afterwards is just nonsense and kidology

 

Froch will beat Groves again, unless Groves goes into "Degale Reverse Gear" for 12

 

TBH the fight I am most looking forward to is actually Chunky, as he is the real boxing talent on show, on the night and he has a real fight on his hands with Martinez

 

Whatever happens a great night of entertainment on the cards

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I dont agree with Ward doing the same to Froch, as Ward was hanging on for the last couple of rounds and he never "Dominated" Froch at any point in that fight, yes he out boxed him at some points of the contest, but to say he was schooled him, is stretching it somewhat

 

I don't think you're talking about the Andre Ward fight.

 

You can't be.  There is no way in this world we are talking about the same fight.

 

It was a unanimous decision, by 8 rounds on one card.

 

It was such a schooling that everyone other than Froch considers a rematch pointless.

 

I think you're confused it with another fight because if you haven't then you'll be the only person I have ever discussed the fight with to have the opinion you do.

 

"Hanging on" he certainly wasn't.  He toyed with Froch in the latter rounds because it was evident Froch had nothing whatsoever to trouble him and he could just dodge the punches with about 5 weeks notice on every one that Froch threw.

 

I agree on armchair pundits.  I did 4 bouts of 4 rounds as a 16 year old and decided it wasn't for me.  I was crap and guess what?  It fecking hurts.  I have total respect for anyone who gets in the ring, but Froch is just so full of himself and has self-elevated to a position where it is just downright irritating now.

 

Boxing is the sport I love above all else but a few rounds in headgear doesn't make me an expert and I've never claimed to be so.  However, I know when I see a boxer completely outclassed - and Froch was.

 

I'm not going to get into the rest of what you've said, because I'm entitled to my opinion and I can't quite see how Groves has said a great deal more worse than Froch.  I have no favourite as to who I want to win in this fight.  I'd say it sounds like you do.

 

I'll say this though - if you think De Gale is a real talent, I think you're deluded.  A brilliant amateur but not made out for the pro ranks and he was rightly and easily beaten by Groves.

 

I am going to ask just how much you know of boxing though?

 

Who is this Martinez you speak of? 

 

Because James De Gale fights Brandon Gonzales tonight..... :roflmao:

Edited by NewNiceMrMe

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Froch in the 7th has my money with my good mate, Paddy Power.

I don't think he'll make the same mistakes as last time and while I'm sure Groves has upped his game, I think Froch will be very focused and will be too clever for him.

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Did anyone else think Groves looked a bit *too* lean at the weigh in?

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I didn't, but only for one reason - he knows he isn't suited to the latter rounds and I think they've been working very hard indeed on his stamina.

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More stamina, fitter and leaner but less power?

I just can't see him catching Froch as hard and as often as he did last time.

I have no favourite to be honest. What I'm looking forward to is a great night for British boxing.

My head would like to see Groves take it. But you can't ignore what Froch has done in the sport and I'd love to see him put a devastating swan-song display on.

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I think it is always difficult to judge how much of an impact any additional fitness will have on power.

 

Ultimately they both have to come in at the same weight so it should be minimal.

 

Unfortunately even if Froch does win I doubt very much it'll be his swan-song.  He still think he should get a Ward rematch.

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Interesting comments all round. Time will tell.

BTW I was talking about the biggest Brit v Brit fight Mrme.

I do rate your opinion as I know you follow the boxing closely.

I also agree with AW about people who have no idea how difficult/tiring it is.

I was teaching some of the guys from the rugby club recently....was funny. It's hard and skillfull and size has nothing to do with power. Skill, speed, balance and fitness.

I am also looking forward to Cotto / Martinez. Two of my favourites.

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Cotto v Martinez will be a good one to watch. +++

 

I'm not convinced Cotta has got it anymore though.  He has taken some severe beatings over the last few years and Martinez still seems as eager as ever to win fights.

 

As you say, it's a sport where power will only help you once in a while.  If you find yourself up against a skillful 'boxer' you genuinely do only stand a punchers chance and most people will never get that chance.  Floyd Mayweather Jnr., a man a despise, is perhaps the best example of the last 25 years of how boxing really is a well honed art and will get you past any opponent.

Edited by NewNiceMrMe

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Mayweathers defence is amazing. I actually like the guy.

Mastering that shoulder roll / Philly shell is so hard.

James Toney was even better at it.

The Shoulder Roll Boxing Masterclass - Mayweather…:

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James Toney is still at it, or at least he was as recently as November last year - in London where he lost against Jason Gavern.

 

Amazing to think the fight in that video with Iran Barkley was 21 years ago, yet Toney was fighting 7 months ago! :roflmao:

 

p.s. and an interesting footnote to that is that the last man to beat Barkley before Toney was.....Nigel Benn.

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I almost forgot to say, £16.95 PPV is appalling.

 

I've bought it because I want to see it, but it is the first time I've ever felt Sky are genuinely taking the piss.

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Anthony Joshua, good lad, terrific yet again.  Huge power.

 

Not much of an opponent but at the end of the day you can only beat whoever is put in front of you.

 

It took James Toney 3 rounds to get rid of him in the last Prizefighter tournament so the boy did well.+++

 

He's our big hope for the heavyweight division anyway.

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£17, I keep looking, thinking I'm a mug. But by 10 PM I know I'll buy. It's wrong but it's worth it for this fight.

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£17, I keep looking, thinking I'm a mug. But by 10 PM I know I'll buy. It's wrong but it's worth it for this fight.

Isn't it an extra fiver after midnight last night?

I've not got Sky, so will listen to it on radio later.

Edited by Soulboy

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Only if you order by phone.

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They offered a discount on early orders. I'd not realised. :(

Still far too much.

That said, I like watching the progress of Joshua and I'm looking forward to watching De Gale get put on his backside (hopefully).

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If not they can F off!

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Wow! What a KO! Bang!

That was an absolute peach!

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How come it is on right now? Is it over?

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All the other fights, Andrew. 10pm for the big one.

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The undercard.

Mitchell is going to lose here. I've not seen Maduma before but he looks very useful.

Will depend on how his stamina is if Mitchell gets past the fifth round.

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The undercard. That's the word I was looking for!

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