Mollox Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 Somewhat concerning noises coming out of the S3 lately…. It’s an ’01 facelift AMK 210 with 48k on the clock. I posted a while back that for about a second after cold start-up I would get something between a whirr and a rattle which occasionally was more pronounced. Since then, just recently its started doing a couple of other things.. - Occasionally on startup whilst turning over it rattles badly, as it its struggling to fire on 3 cylinders - Now, whenever I get back on the gas, even if it’s just feathering I can hear a brief muffled rattle of about a second in duration. So if for example I pull away, I’ll go about a metre and then brrrrrr and then normal. When I lift off to change gear, slot in a new gear, let the clutch out and then squeeze the gas there will be a slight pause and then brrrr. I can hear it in other gears too. Interestingly (worryingly?) I don’t get the noise if I rev the car when stationary with no drive engaged. Am worried! Are these warnings of imminent cambelt doom? Ideally I’d like to get an idea before walking into the stealers and letting them assfeck me without a clue Any ideas? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitas3 Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 are you at Windsor on Wednesday? If so I'll have a listen for you if you want. I wouldn't have thought it was cambelt related - how about flywheel?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexc Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 [ QUOTE ] Somewhat concerning noises coming out of the S3 lately…. It’s an ’01 facelift AMK 210 with 48k on the clock. I posted a while back that for about a second after cold start-up I would get something between a whirr and a rattle which occasionally was more pronounced. Since then, just recently its started doing a couple of other things.. - Occasionally on startup whilst turning over it rattles badly, as it its struggling to fire on 3 cylinders - Now, whenever I get back on the gas, even if it’s just feathering I can hear a brief muffled rattle of about a second in duration. So if for example I pull away, I’ll go about a metre and then brrrrrr and then normal. When I lift off to change gear, slot in a new gear, let the clutch out and then squeeze the gas there will be a slight pause and then brrrr. I can hear it in other gears too. Interestingly (worryingly?) I don’t get the noise if I rev the car when stationary with no drive engaged. Am worried! Are these warnings of imminent cambelt doom? Ideally I’d like to get an idea before walking into the stealers and letting them assfeck me without a clue Any ideas? Thanks [/ QUOTE ] Have you had the timing belt and tensioner replaced yet, it should be done every 50-60k? It sounds like it's only making that noise when the engine is under load so if you haven't had them done yet, I would do so sooner rather than later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitas3 Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 as a comparison, my 2002 S3 is now at 60k and no rattles etc like this. Inigo, does the rattle noise disappear above 2k revs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shark_90 Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 How often do you change the oil Molly? I hate to point every 1.8T rattle problem along the road of the cam chain variator but if it's being starved of oil that could well be the problem, especially as you mention the noise at cold start up (which is definately the noise we're looking for) and if it is that same noise when the engine is warm it could be worth checking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mo-S3 Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 I dont think a cambelt would cause the engine to shake or rattle like you have described. If it did then it would be a great early warning system. Really could do with a second pair of ears listening to it whilst your driving and trying to isolate the area from where its coming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mollox Posted April 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 Thanks for the thoughts guys, Lets see – Sita – I can’t tell for sure but to me it sounds the sort of noise I’d expect to come from the head. The start-up rattle and rattle when coming onto the gas are separate but in my mind must be related…? Not at Windsor tomorrow I’m afraid. Alex, I’m confused – I thought cam belt and tensioner replacement was at 115,000 or 80,000 depending on engine variant? Shark – not often enough. Been thinking recently that AVS was wrong as I just don’t do any miles these days. Its had 2 oil changes to date as per AVS.What’s your description of the start-up rattle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shark_90 Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 If you're on AVS, and doing low miles, then that's another tick box ticked I'm afraid.. Mine rattles (and it's very pronounced) quite often on cold start up, just after the engine fires there's a definate "burrr" that slightly changes pitch over the time of about 1-1.5 seconds and then disappears. What causes this is that the cam chain variator is hydraulic and oil needs to get up to it for it to get to the correct tension and tighten the chain, to stop the chain rattling. Newer 1.8T's have a non-return valve to combat the rattle as naturally some more astute owners noticed it and thought it was a problem. The rattle on startup isn't a problem in itself, but if it's rattling at any other time it means that it's being starved of oil. Although your oil light won't come on until the oil pressure is dangerously low (I think 1.6bar) operating pressure should be above 2bar and when revving it should be well over 3bar. If I were you I'd get an independant to do an oil pressure check and see what's happening. Also, take your oil cap off and look inside the engine. It should be silver in colour with no major staining. Mine inside is a very brown colour (after experiencing this problem) and that could be an indicator too. I don't want to go any further into the problem without you doing that incase I'm scaring you and perhaps pulling your attention away from what might be a totally different problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shark_90 Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 Oh and last piece of advice mate, take it off AVS immediately. I'd advise anyone else with a 1.8T to do the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mollox Posted April 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 Shark, has yours blown? Is this how you're such an expert? I forgot to add, I did get a low oil warning come on a few months back and put the remainder of my bottle of oil into it. I suppose I should do an oil check, eh? Are you talking about a simple lack of oil or a deeper oil pressure issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mollox Posted April 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 Re whether the rattle happens when under load or 2k revs... I know "load" is an odd one - I notice it most when I'm being really ginger with the throttle - i.e. pulling away or just coming back onto the gas and feathering it (i.e. as opposed to when the engine's screaming and I wouldn't hear it anyway). Sita - what are you thinking re 2k rpm - you might have a point, but I'd have to check.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mollox Posted April 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 P.s. I am now bricking it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shark_90 Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 Mine had the problem when J_C owned it. He paid a lot, and I mean a lot, of money to get it fixed. It *could* be a simple lack of oil, but I'd be surprised. If the level is OK then you really need to get a pressure check done. Sharpish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mollox Posted April 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 Can you pm me your number? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mollox Posted April 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 I'm rootling around for expenses receipts as we speak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mollox Posted April 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 And can you get an oil pressure readout on the climate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitas3 Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 [ QUOTE ] Sita - what are you thinking re 2k rpm - you might have a point, but I'd have to check.... [/ QUOTE ] I'm thinking noises related to drivetrain/clutch/flywheel are more apparent up to 2k revs IMHO. Bear in mind DHA had the clutch changed on mine at 42k miles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mollox Posted April 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 I'm not bearing in mind anything right now, I want to cry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitas3 Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 [ QUOTE ] And can you get an oil pressure readout on the climate? [/ QUOTE ] I 'Think' you can as it is a Vag-com type measuring block. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mollox Posted April 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 Hmm, maybe not Linky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shark_90 Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 You have a PM mate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexc Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 If it was an oil starvation issue, then it would rattle regardless of the clutch being engaged or not. Definitely get an oil pressure check done but I think it could be something else. In my experience, a rattle under load relates to a timing issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexc Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 [ QUOTE ] Thanks for the thoughts guys, Lets see – Alex, I’m confused – I thought cam belt and tensioner replacement was at 115,000 or 80,000 depending on engine variant? [/ QUOTE ] I wouldn't leave it as long as that, personally I think 60-80k max, no more than that, the cost of replacing them is just a fraction of what it would cost to put your engine right if it were to fail! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shao_khan Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 Does this sound like the issue - taken from VW FAQ: 1.8 20V Turbo Engine AUM, AUQ Faults 1) F. Light rattling noise from engine at start up C. Lack of oil pressure to cam chain tensioner C. Replacement of cam chain tensioner or clean out block oil feed pick up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shark_90 Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 That's what I'm getting at SK, although it could obviously be other things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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