puttling Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 May have missed this post or thread in the past, but was wondering what you lot thought of the ST compared to the GTi in terms of performance, build quality and handling. Not really interested in the price as I realise that if you buy cheap then you sell cheap. I look forward to you comments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rs32 Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 ST3 TSN review another one and another one - including GTI comparison Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRobin Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 ....Great comparison review written by encee . Thanks for the link, Rich . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zharca Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 Hi, having owned a whole string of rs-type Fords over the past 15years, swopping our ST170 for an ST3 as soon as they came out appeared to be a no-brainer. We didn't for the simple reason that the thing is basically ugly, looks cheap and comes with a very limited, poor colour choice. The all black interior is seriously gloomy and has some tacky details. Dynamically fine, they're starting with a good chassis and a very well proven Volvo engine but if you had put those plastic trim bits, the wheels, optional stripes and that orange colour on yourself you'd be up on the chavmobile thread. We finally ended up with an R32 which is in a different league, but the GTi runs it close. No contest if you have even a modicum of taste (or shame). OK for driving around in, providing nobody sees you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puttling Posted January 11, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 Nice one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simonl Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 I think they sound lovely and look great TBH. But when i sat in one i was deeply dissapointed by both the cheap gloomy interior, and awkward seating poistion. I bet it's a hoot to drive though. GTI hasn't got a great sounding engine, although it is a great engine. I would think the ST would have the edge over a GTI in the traffic light Grand Prix, but round the twisties i very much doubt they'd be much in it. The GTi is a very nimble car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D1MAC Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 [ QUOTE ] I think they sound lovely and look great TBH. But when i sat in one i was deeply dissapointed by both the cheap gloomy interior, and awkward seating poistion. I bet it's a hoot to drive though. GTI hasn't got a great sounding engine, although it is a great engine. I would think the ST would have the edge over a GTI in the traffic light Grand Prix, but round the twisties i very much doubt they'd be much in it. The GTi is a very nimble car. [/ QUOTE ] I'm surprised that you found the interior 'cheap & gloomy'. I looked at both (amongst others) and I would have said that while the ST interior isn't quite at the Golf level it's a hell of a lot closer than it was in the past and I would say it's within 10% or so. As for gloomy - afraid I really can't see the difference between the two apart from the seats and if you go for leather then they are both as dark as each other. On the seat front, I think the height of the Recaros in the ST is probably what causes the problem there, apart from that there is more than enough adjustment for seats & wheel to get comfy. I haven't actually driven a GTI but FWIW I would suspect that fuel consumption apart the ST engine is at least on a par. Although it might not quite rev quite as freely it does make up for it with the sound and let's face it, neither is a full fat Honda motor! I think your right on the Grand Prix but would guess that there is 5% in it max and in the real world you wouldn't notice the difference below 3 figures. If I had to say or be damned then I would guess that a GTI has 90% of the R32's performance and the ST 95% (although I have seen more than one R.Road that suggests that the R32's horses are a bit lame , whereas those of the GTI & ST aren't). Handling wise I would also agree as to me the ST seems a bit wobbly compared to CTR and I can only go off what others say about the GTI. The big thing for me is that once the £2.5k + price difference is taken into account there is nothing in it and for me the ST won out. In fact in my case the difference was more like £5k and that's just too big to ignore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D1MAC Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 [ QUOTE ] Hi, having owned a whole string of rs-type Fords over the past 15years, swopping our ST170 for an ST3 as soon as they came out appeared to be a no-brainer. We didn't for the simple reason that the thing is basically ugly, looks cheap and comes with a very limited, poor colour choice. The all black interior is seriously gloomy and has some tacky details. Dynamically fine, they're starting with a good chassis and a very well proven Volvo engine but if you had put those plastic trim bits, the wheels, optional stripes and that orange colour on yourself you'd be up on the chavmobile thread. We finally ended up with an R32 which is in a different league, but the GTi runs it close. No contest if you have even a modicum of taste (or shame). OK for driving around in, providing nobody sees you [/ QUOTE ] With a nice balanced view like that you must be popular at parties. Ugly - What do you want, a Lamborghini! Neither the ST or the GTI look fabulous but both look OK (the ST is helped an awful lot by colour choice). Looks cheap - How exactly? Not at all like the R32 with that classy shiny beak. Granted the 'chrome' bits on front and back bumper and the ST badges on the wings aren't brilliant but you really have lost me on that one! Colour choice - Apart from the truly awful Electric Orange on the ST and a couple of additional (and really exciting) blacks/blues the Golfs & ST come in the same colours Interior - No more gloomy than the Golf and not that far behind in tackiness or lack of. A bit granted but what do you want for several £k less Wheels - Each to their own but the R32 wheels aren't exactly restrained. 18" Monza's are much nicer than either though. Stripes - OPTIONAL! Electric Orange - Agree 100% there as it's . Something more tasteful (as per attached) is much better. Thing is thoug, when it's on an ST it's Chavtastic but when it's on S3 no one bats an eyelid. Yes the GTI & R32 are good cars (I considered both strongly) but if you really need to sit behind a VW badge to give you any taste or lack of shame then I really feel sorry for you. The phrase 'I'm considerably richer than you are' (in appropriate W.Midlands accent) comes to mind. Try and be a bit less black and white chief Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fresco1 Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 At the end of day we each buy what we like best / or what suits our needs best. As long as we're happy - live and let live! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muppetboy Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 [ QUOTE ] Neither the ST or the GTI look fabulous [/ QUOTE ] Feck off I think the GTI looks the dogs bollox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D1MAC Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 But after all it is only a Euro interpretation of a Civic, tallness and all I do like the GTI on 18" (simply HAS to be the bigger Monzas) in the right colour but IMO the R32 is a bit more of an acquired taste - only really liked it in silver and grey. Had the price situation been a bit more favourable I would have had a tough choice but the wait for a new one and some of the fast ones the stealers were pulling on used ones just put me off that bit too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simonl Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 [ QUOTE ] I think the height of the Recaros in the ST is probably what causes the problem there [/ QUOTE ] That was the problem mate. They felt way too high and a real shame IMO. Not helped by the fact that i'm 6,4" which made the problem feel worse. I'd like to see an ST in a showroom, the one i sat in was at the motorshow and was swamped by Chavs. I think they are a great car for the money tho, and have a fabulous sounding engine - i also think your comparism with the .:R are spot on too. I used to have a manual A3 3.2, and personally - it felt no quicker than my DSG GTI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashleywater Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 Hi Leman Sounds like you need a Golf plus plus I am 6'1" and about the same accross so Recaros are a no go, as I say "once in, never out" My euros worth on the ST: ST suffers from much higher depreciation than the GTI,but hey "Who gives a Feck!" I would say that the ST doesn't quite match the GTI in the "good looks" department when the GTI is fitted with 18" Monzas. Performance wise they each have there "sweet spots" ST is totally VFM discounting the depreciation issue As for the "tango" colour I happen to think it looks cool on both the ST & the S3, but would I want to live with it, first thing every morning. Sort of like Jade Hoody, the novelty wears off extremely quickly............. I have to say though that she seems to have bonded with some guy, who is even more "dense" than the "hoody" herself, a major achievement in itself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simonl Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 lol, Jack Tweedy lives about 10 doors away from me. I see her most mornings, looking like a toad driving her Range Rover Sport or her 997S Cabrio... tragic isn't it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhardy22 Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 I second that, the GT is shocking............all fords look the same!!, the st looks like its crashed into halfords!. The ST is not on the same par as the GTI.......FACT !!!! Thank-you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zharca Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 [ QUOTE ] ... the st looks like its crashed into halfords!. ... [/ QUOTE ] Nice one! Yoof these days get it easy. When I were a lad you had to work real hard sticking on stripes and trim and wheels and stuff to make your car look crap, now the factory will do it for you. World gone soft or what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoopy Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 [ QUOTE ] ST suffers from much higher depreciation than the GTI, [/ QUOTE ] Here we go again not in pound notes lost terms it does not in % terms yes but i don't count money in % terms. I know the ST is quicker in a straight line over 1 miles of private road than both DSG and manual standard GTIs. It starts pulling away from about 80mph. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simonl Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 I certainly wouldn't want to come up against an ST at the lights ... well tell a lie, i would, it would be interesting but i bet it suffers more than the GTI when it comes to laying down the power. A 220hp 5cyl Turbo is not ideal through the front wheels..! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRobin Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 Driving up the M5 earlier today I got very closely tailgated by a female driving blue a Mondeo ST - She was one of those who get so close they're virtually pushing you . I don't like close tailgaters, female or pretty or otherwise, so I gradually slowed until there was a much bigger distance in front of me, popped mine into S-mode and floored it just to see how well she would hang on. She only stayed with me for a very short distance, I settled back down and changed to inner lane to let her get on with whatever. She stayed back and didn't come near me again! Perhaps she was just trying to read my Tyresmoke sticker! I'm not saying that my GTI is faster than a Mondeo ST but I certainly out accelerated this one from about 70 on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentandy Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 In the real world there is nothing in it performance wise. I came up against an ST on a dual carriage way a couple of months back. There was a car in front of us doing about 30, once he got out of the way we both floored it at the same time. There was absolutely nothing in it, the gap between us only changed during gear changes where DSG closed the gap ever so slightly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoopy Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 Leman, A theory to explain why i found my mates ST to have better traction off the line than my GTI to me anyway, Extra weight over the front more traction? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentandy Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 I should have added, the ST at full chat sounded great Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoopy Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 The main problem i have with the ST is its name it sounds like some sort of STD more so than DSG even. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D1MAC Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 [ QUOTE ] I second that, the GT is shocking............all fords look the same!!, the st looks like its crashed into halfords!. The ST is not on the same par as the GTI.......FACT !!!! Thank-you [/ QUOTE ] And of course no VW looks anything like any other VW in any way, shape or form. If this is the kind of person the GTI (and TSN for that matter) attracts these days then I would be worried. I think you will find in harsh reality there is relatively little between the two apart from several £k of price difference - some think it's worth it and some of us would rather keep the money for other things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D1MAC Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 [ QUOTE ] I certainly wouldn't want to come up against an ST at the lights ... well tell a lie, i would, it would be interesting but i bet it suffers more than the GTI when it comes to laying down the power. A 220hp 5cyl Turbo is not ideal through the front wheels..! [/ QUOTE ] Torque is limited in at least 1st and 2cnd so along with 8" wide wheels it's actually reasonably difficult to spin too much (unless you are being silly). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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