RedRobin Posted September 7, 2006 Report Share Posted September 7, 2006 I'm considering an aftermarket (AP Racing) big brake conversion - Fronts only. The kit comes with everything good that you would expect from AP (Brembo owned) - Ferodo DS2500 pads and stainless steel braided hoses and appropriate fluid. The discs are grooved and not drilled. My question is what is the average life expectancy of Discs (not the pads)? I realise that it would depend on usage. I'm road, not track, and a very infrequent brakes user except when I'm driving very hard, which is when I want the safest max braking I can get! As ever, many thanks for any helpful replies . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mook Posted September 7, 2006 Report Share Posted September 7, 2006 Depending on your style of driving OEM disks should last anything beyond 50K miles. The make-up of the AP racing disks may be different, so it reacts better to heat, so can't say whether you would expect these to last longer than OEM disks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRobin Posted September 7, 2006 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2006 Mook. I've also emailed AP to hear their thoughts. It seems to me that subject to the 'individual driving style' that they will last quite long. These particular discs are what AP call "Performance Road Products" and I know that they differentiate them from track. They would work well for occasional track days if I did any. In my relative ignorance I am keen not to invest in something that will need expensively replacing fairly often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soundwave Posted September 8, 2006 Report Share Posted September 8, 2006 Well, I'll tell you this much: I had a Tarox six-pot conversion done on my old Rover Coupe Turbo. When I was driving hard (and I mean hard), fade was absolutely not an issue, in fact the hotter they got, the better they were. But, and is it a but, from cold, the brakes were terrible. I'd have to be very, very careful from cold. To be honest, if I drove normally (that is to say, not use the brakes that much or just brake from normal speeds), then the brakes wouldn't really heat up and therefore stay terrible! But they were pretty much the most extreme brake pad material available; I dare say if you had the conversion done (4 or 6 pot) but with less extreme (less hard) pads, I'm sure you'd be happy. Trouble is, how does one go about 'testing' pads? You'd either have to sample some pads on another car (hot and cold) or if that's not possible then I'm sure that even with a conversion you could ask or specify some sort of intermediate pads. From memory there are prettty much 3 types of pad material: Normal road use (still upgraded from standard but much safer when cold), full race pads (unbelievable fade resistance but poor when cold) and then there is a kind of 'fast-road' use type of pad which tries to be somewhere in the middle. The best example of this is someone like EBC brakes who offer 'green-stuff', 'red-stuff' and 'yellow-stuff' pads to cover all bases (they have since released other types of pads). So in summary, I reckon the brakes themselves are not in question but the pads. It's imperative to get the right ones for your driving style or you'll regret having the conversion done in the first place. Happily, I discovered it was the pads causing my concerns and was able to change them before I decided to 'undo' the conversion! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRobin Posted September 8, 2006 Author Report Share Posted September 8, 2006 Hi keytone, that's very helpful and informative info you have posted - Much appreciated. However, earlier this year I spent a whole afternoon with a Senior Engineer at AP Racing (owned by Brembo who are better known) and learnt all about their brakes. Without giving a long list of their clients and credentials over many decades, I am extremely confident in them. They used to be known as Lockheed and are a prime example of an English development and manufacturing company that hasn't gone under and are well respected. The Milltek of the brake and clutch (F1 included) world . The brake kit they are fitting for me is a "Performance Road Product" and has undergone months of testing. Also, fellow TSNer SiBurt has them on his car and is very very pleased....In fact, he introduced me to AP. You are spot on re the importance of pads. Ferodo DS2500 is what AP will be fitting. Inappropriate 'competition' pads may result in high wear and even premature cracking. I have also discussed my VW warranty with my VW dealer and he is totally happy about the APR brakes. At servicing, when I need new pads I will supply new DS2500s for my dealer to happily fit. AP Racing are well established experts in this field so I am trusting them and taking all their advice - I would be utterly stupid not to! I don't expect there are many of us here who will be rushing out to upgrade their GTI's brakes - Afterall the OEM are excellent. However, I would say it's worth considering, and possibly advisable, for a re-mapped car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soundwave Posted September 9, 2006 Report Share Posted September 9, 2006 Not sure if I came across right there. I meant that it's important to get the right pads after the conversion.. I'm sure you understood what I meant! Anyway, good luck with the conversion and I'd be really interested to hear your post-conversion report, I know it'll be in-depth and invaluable to all us TSNers! My brakes are in need of replacement on the A6 at the mo, and I too have been wondering what to do. I know the discs are warped because I can feel it. It's a damn heavy car (even heavier now it's got 19" wheels) and I reckon the oem brakes are a bit pants TBH. If your experience goes well, I'd seriously consider doing it to the A6 beast. Mods so far are: H&R full coilover kit 19" A8 replicas Doing the brakes would probably be my next upgrade especially as they need doing anyway! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Posted September 9, 2006 Report Share Posted September 9, 2006 as an indicator. remapped S3, no track use. Porsche OEM Textar pads circa £20k miles Porsche OEM drilled discs (cast in holes) circa 40k miles. budget for a set of discs on fitting 3rd set of pads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brisel Posted September 10, 2006 Report Share Posted September 10, 2006 Anyone using Tarox discs? Jabbasport have recommended that I have Tarox grooved discs & DS2500 pads. They have quoted £603 fitted against £548 for OEM discs & pads. They advised AGAINST drilled discs as they were more prone to cracking. I'd rather have too much braking efficiency than not enough. My OEM set up hasn't quite been the same since a track day... Sorry to hijack your thread, RR! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRobin Posted September 10, 2006 Author Report Share Posted September 10, 2006 No problem, Brisel . I've been told the same about drilled discs. I may be wrong but I think some can be cast with holes - I may be wrong about that. I know that some cheaper quality discs have been offered drilled just because it looks good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soundwave Posted September 11, 2006 Report Share Posted September 11, 2006 [ QUOTE ] Anyone using Tarox discs? [/ QUOTE ] They were in fact the very brand of discs I had on my old Rover Turbo and the discs themselves were very good. They were the 40 groove 'G88' discs which are designed to channel the friction gasses away out along the grooves to the edge. It's the pads I had the issue with. I didn't do my homework and ended up with competition pads for everyday road use! (They were in fact Tarox pads that came with the kit). From cold they were pants! When hot, they'd resist fade almost indefinitely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mook Posted September 12, 2006 Report Share Posted September 12, 2006 Helfinger runs 12 pot Tarox disks and calipers on his supercharged Mk4 R32 and is more than happy with them. A bit more than £603 to buy, though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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