jmw748 Posted January 23, 2009 Report Share Posted January 23, 2009 After seeing CAT recommended here, I called them up and they inspired confidence immediately. I had already checked out two local "transmission specialists" who shall remain nameless who scared me witless with their lack of knowledge. Importantly, CAT seem to be the only company I've found that has a machine to remove all the old gearbox oil. They sourced Esso ATF for me (the bulk of the cost) and talked me through the entire process. The best bit was watching the "gearbox dialysis" machine replacing my old manky, black oil with clear new Esso. The process doesn't take very long at all (they only charge an hour labour)and you can actually watch the process happening. I've taken some pics (as usual), but I left my camera at home (DOH), so Blackberry Curve photos won't be great. These guys really know their business and I would highly recommend them. Total cost was 228 pounds for gearbox sump gasket, 11 Litres of Esso ATF, new gearbox oil filter (with the o ring!!). They had to drill out one bolt (50% of them were quite seized in the sump) that had sheared and helicoil a new one in (30 minutes extra work). They'd tried everything first (heat etc) before the bolt gave out (not bad since half of them were seized in the sump) and they let me watch as their ex RAF Hawk jet engineer expertly drilled out the snapped bolt with a home-made jig and inserted the replacement bolt perfectly. They didn't charge me extra labour for this work. I was shown round the entire workshop and talked for ages about gearboxes, test rigs, electronics and hydraulics. Great guys to deal with, expert knowledge on ZF transmissions - I can't recommend them enough. Friendly bunch with nothing to hide. I learnt more about gearboxes in 20 minutes with them than I ever could elsewhere. If you're in the North West, use these guys. If you're not, I'd still recommend them -they've delivered gearboxes to clients in Bournemouth and France recently!! I'll post the pics up when I get them off my Blackberry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abs Posted January 23, 2009 Report Share Posted January 23, 2009 That sounds fantastic! Thanks for the write up and recommendation. I'm sure it will help a lot of people in the future. A couple of questions though... 1) Did you have to explain the procedure to them first, or did they already know what to do when you said that you want the gearbox oil, filter and gasket changed? 2) Did you have to source the parts or did they get everything? 3) Is this the people.... http://www.transcentre.co.uk/ 4) What A8/S8 do you have? Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmw748 Posted January 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2009 (edited) Abs, 1) When I started to talk to them about the procedure, it was clear that they already knew everything about our gearboxes. They couldn't believe that an Audi stealer had not fitted the gearbox filter o-ring:eek: for one of the guys here. They just do auto gearboxes - nothing else! I saw at least 10 gearboxes in various stages of rebuild. 4 cars arrived from various local garages whilst I was there. They were also custom-strengthening Lincoln and Hummer gearboxes. Experts at electronics too - talked me thorugh the solenoid functions in mine (I'm an ex electronics technician) and they really knew their stuff. 2) They sourced everthing (OEM Audi kit) and sourced the Esso from their supplier. I think I could have got the oil cheaper from here: Lubricants.org | The UK`s Oilstore | Esso ATF LT 71141 | Exxonmobil. They were quite happy for me to bring the oil with me, but I didn't bother (booked me in at short notice). 3) Yes, that's them: http://www.transcentre.co.uk/ , ask for Graham. 4) Strangely enough, a 2002 S8 Final Edition I absolutely love the car and was doing this as a preventative measure - no problems with my gearbox yet. The oil was black though and enough fine metal particles in the sump and around the magnets to prove it was necessary after 100K miles. I'll get the pics up as soon as I can mate. P.S. They do the complete oil change with their machine at no extra cost (bar the extra oil obviously). NOBODY else offered this service to me and I watched the machine do the business. So pretty much everyone else is leaving old oil in the torque converter and front of the gearbox - not ideal in my opinion, so it was a no-brainer for me to use these guys. Edited January 23, 2009 by jmw748 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abs Posted January 23, 2009 Report Share Posted January 23, 2009 That's brilliant, thanks! Did they do this all whilst you wait? (did you have to leave the car there for a while?) Also, a few people have mentioned that after doing a couple of hundered miles, the oil may need topping up... did they suggest anything like this? Mine is on 60k at the moment, so I was thinking of also getting it done, just as a preventative precaution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmw748 Posted January 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 Once the entire gearbox has been filled (over 9litres IIRC), there should be no need to refill. Their machine works like a brake bleeder: you see one tube with your dark, used oil and one with the new Esso ATF. They connect the machine via the oil cooler at the front of the engine and start pumping the new oil through. It's a close loop process, so their machine pumped 11 litres in and they released some to get the final level right. I shouldn't need to go back. I did mine as a preventative measure (much later than you, mine had 110K). At 60K, I'd have it in straight away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harpersimon Posted January 24, 2009 Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 They sound great.. I also have a couple of questions though - The well known procedure advises all about the oil temp being checked, and the gears all being run through (PRND234 and back) How did they 'test' the box? Do they take the oil temp into consideration? How do they exactly know the level in the box without filling through an open level plug, engine running - or does the machine measure the oil out and in? Sounds ace.. but you can appreciate people being wary after the horry story's! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmw748 Posted January 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 (edited) Simon, The machine physically measures oil in and out (there are two clear tubes with new and old oil visible and a digital readout on top which counts the injection process in .1lts increments. They "injected" the new oil in phases, doing checks as they went along. They had the engine running as they carried out the procedure, becuase they connected their machine to the oil cooler pipes at the front of the car (effectively pumping new oil into the sytem from one side as the other side of the system was connected to the machine, extracting the old oil). It was like performing gearbox oil dialysis. At the end they ran the car until an amount overspilled from the drain plug and from the readout they could see how much oil had been consumed by the gearbox flush. Very quick procedure and you simply don't have to wait overnight to see how much you can drain. They do this with all the gearboxes they service. I spoke to a customer who had passed 300K on his auto car (I didn't ask which model - DOH!) which they they had serviced regularly and his auto Lexus had just passed 210K - same system used for his cars. I need to take the photos from my phone to help explain the process. Edited January 24, 2009 by jmw748 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IT_S8 Posted January 25, 2009 Report Share Posted January 25, 2009 Thumbs up from me too, its one of the transmission specialists that I'd recommend for (a) knowing their stuff and (b) actually doing something useful with that knowledge! There super-sucky-pumpy-squirty oil changing system is the nuts too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Architex mA8tey Posted January 25, 2009 Report Share Posted January 25, 2009 There super-sucky-pumpy-squirty oil changing system is the nuts too. God Ian sometimes you are talking just tooooo technical for me Please dont tell me you used to be a civil servant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmw748 Posted January 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2009 There super-sucky-pumpy-squirty oil changing system is the nuts too. I think that's what the sticker on the machine actually said on the prototype, but then the marketing folks got involved! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camowagen Posted January 25, 2009 Report Share Posted January 25, 2009 jmw when you say local specialists, who do you mean as i want mine doing as i have a bit of a concern with it at the mo and dont know where to take it. cheers nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmw748 Posted January 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2009 Just realized I hadn't answere two important points above: 1. How long does it take/While you wait service? The whole process can be done in under 2 hours (they only charge 60 pounds labour!), so yes they do it while you wait. Mine took longer because half the sump bolts were seized, so they carefully removed them and only one snapped. 2. Trying the gearbox in all gears - they simply take the car for a shakedown drive after the procedure, then check for leaks or problems before replacing the front valance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harpersimon Posted January 26, 2009 Report Share Posted January 26, 2009 I am saving my £228 as we speak - might be a drive down there but sounds like its worth a day off one day! Thanks for the write up and endorsement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harpersimon Posted January 26, 2009 Report Share Posted January 26, 2009 There super-sucky-pumpy-squirty oil changing system is the nuts too. I think that's what the sticker on the machine actually said on the prototype, but then the marketing folks got involved! AKA: The TECH-TRONIX ATS300 "Its Super, and it Sucks.. " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harpersimon Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 I've had a curious thought that I can't get out of my head - how do they change the oil by pumping new in and sucking old out, when they have had to take the gearbox sump off to change the filter?? At some stage there must be no oil in the box - or do they suck out, change filter and THEN pump in. Call me confused from Lancs.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJP Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 I was wondering this too. Audi VW in Stonehouse Glos has the same, or similar, machine, and they used it on my S8 last year. They insisted that there was no need to change the filter or disassemble the sump, as they could flush everything out of the filter backwards. It was not a bargain (ie about the same price, for much less work) and used improbable amounts of fluid, but I have had no problems since, and I can almost convince myself it changes better than it did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmw748 Posted February 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 I was wondering this too. Audi VW in Stonehouse Glos has the same, or similar, machine, and they used it on my S8 last year. They insisted that there was no need to change the filter or disassemble the sump, as they could flush everything out of the filter backwards. It was not a bargain (ie about the same price, for much less work) and used improbable amounts of fluid, but I have had no problems since, and I can almost convince myself it changes better than it did. I'm no expert, but changing gearbox oil without changing the filter seems like a very odd move. The amount of metal particles that were clinging to the sump cover magnets was enough to convince me that I'd done the right thing ( and they couldn't possibly be sucked back through the filter). I suppose it depends on the age of car, mileage etc. But a full gearbox oil change would suggest that it's absolutely necessary to change all the consumables too? I've yet to meet a main stealer expert on gearboxes for any make of car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonlittle Posted August 5, 2010 Report Share Posted August 5, 2010 Hi there, after reading all these threads I took 2 trips to Chester Transmissions and on the second time had my ATF changed in my 1996 4.2 Quattro Sports with a 4 SPEED tranny, which was actually changed back in May this year by Carvers in Denton (DONT USE THESE GUYS BY THE WAY) when I should have gone straight to Chester who are the real guys!!!....the super-sucky-pumpy-squirty oil changing system is actually a machine they used to import and sell from Canada and thought you would now like a picture........:- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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