olliblue Posted April 26, 2006 Report Share Posted April 26, 2006 Hi, after reading an review in a Belgian mag today, I wonder what you guys think about the recently released GT TDI and TSI versions. The magazines states that the TSI version has the same performance ( 0-60 in 7,1s), same engine sounds, almost same looks as the GTI... but is cheaper and has a better mpg. I must add that the cc of an engine is very important in the Belgian tax system, which would make the GT a better buy. I just ordered a GTI and am in no way planning to change that, because imho there is still a big difference. What are your thoughts on this? Would you buy a GT TSI? I'm not sure how the UK tax and insurance system works, would it make a difference? In my case, it would make the car 2000£ cheaper, but DSG is not avail yet, so guess that would make it 1000£ cheaper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarmac_Terrorist Posted April 26, 2006 Report Share Posted April 26, 2006 Hi Olliblue, I personally think the cars are very different IMO and I haven't yet owned a GTI. The GT is quick on paper 0-60 but it's through the gears 30-80mph that counts. I also believe it's got a different suspension set up too. If I couldn't stretch to a GTI based upon price then I would be very interested as it looks a good car. I understand that that new turbo & supercharged engine can be seriously upgraded. I was reading a VW mag (can't remember which one)waiting to have my hair cut only last week and they reckoned that it could be tuned beyond what a GTI could be tuned. 5 years time they'll be loads to be seen in Supermarket car parks after 8pm with large carlos fandango's on them waiting for a GTI to burn up I think other manufacturers may follow this technology as time goes on. Good fuel economy & performance for petrol power....end of the diesel engine? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muppetboy Posted April 26, 2006 Report Share Posted April 26, 2006 From what I've read the GT TDI 168bhp just appears to be a quicker version of the current 2.0 TDI. Yes it's got a couple of visual differences and different alloys (not to my taste though) but a GTI it aint. Having said that for someone looking for a very subtle yet quick Golf it's probably a great choice. And stingy on fuel. VW in the UK are charging quite a premium for it over the already not-so-cheap 2.0 TDI... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gtiveedubber Posted April 27, 2006 Report Share Posted April 27, 2006 [ QUOTE ] From what I've read the GT TDI 168bhp just appears to be a quicker version of the current 2.0 TDI. [/ QUOTE ] Yes, but think of all the torque the car will have! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olliblue Posted April 27, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2006 and both GT versions will have a "Winter" mode to reduce the torque when driving in heavy snow or rain GTIVeeDubber, I see your baby is arriving in December, is that a personal choice, or is that the delivery time in Aus? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neimad Posted April 27, 2006 Report Share Posted April 27, 2006 To be quite honest, I was actually quite gutted when they first announced these two GT models. At that point I'd already ordered a GTI, but since I do ~400 miles a week commuting to work and back the GT seemed like a much better buy. Still, since it wasn't to be available for a good while I figured I wasn't missing that much and that I'd probably kick myself later if I passed up on the GTI. As it stands now, I still don't yet have the GTI, petrol prices are rising swiftly and the GT still looks to be the more sensible option as far as fuel economy, etc. go. Alright, the GT is ~0.7 seconds slower than the manual GTI (the 0-62mph is quoted as 7.8s for the TSI, no figure for the diesel but it'll be in that ballpark), but I'd bet it would still be more than capable of putting a smile on your face -- the chassis is the same after all. I guess the real question is "what do you want?" I want a car mainly for commuting, but one also capable of putting a grin on my face if I decide to take the lanes home instead of the motorway. So yes, the GT is probably still the more sensible choice in my situation, but if I were being sensible I'd have bought a cheap diesel Ford Focus (no disrespect to the Ford -- it's a very well-setup car and diesel-torque would make it effortless to drive whilst also keeping the cost of running it lower). When you really enjoy driving thought, cars are not bought with the head, they're bought with the heart, and in that case there never will be a comparison between the GT and the GTI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muppetboy Posted April 27, 2006 Report Share Posted April 27, 2006 Fuel economy on the GTI isn't terrible - around 30-31mpg with 50% motorway and 50% town for me. The diesel 0-60 is in the 8 second zone I believe. As for smiles... mate you just wouldn't believe the satisfaction owning a GTI gives you... so what if it's a few grand more than a GT, it's so feckin' worth it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotw Posted April 27, 2006 Report Share Posted April 27, 2006 I would have certainly considered a Petrol GT, 170bhp and good mpg is nice, BUT, I wouldn't swop my GTi for anything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neimad Posted April 27, 2006 Report Share Posted April 27, 2006 [ QUOTE ] Fuel economy on the GTI isn't terrible - around 30-31mpg with 50% motorway and 50% town for me. The diesel 0-60 is in the 8 second zone I believe. As for smiles... mate you just wouldn't believe the satisfaction owning a GTI gives you... so what if it's a few grand more than a GT, it's so feckin' worth it! [/ QUOTE ] I currently average ~45mpg and around 350-400 miles from the 45 litre tank in my 1.4litre VW Polo, so believe me when I say that when I get the GTI it's going to be a culture shock... in more than one way. I have no doubt that I'll enjoy every minute of owning a GTI, I just hope that the fuel bills and other associated costs don't force me to part company with it earlier than anticipated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olliblue Posted April 27, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2006 The mag states that the 0-60 figures given by VW are purposely incorrect, and that it's actually the same as the gti according to their results. They suppose vw did this to keep the gti in the spotlight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metalex Posted April 28, 2006 Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 [ QUOTE ] The mag states that the 0-60 figures given by VW are purposely incorrect, and that it's actually the same as the gti according to their results. They suppose vw did this to keep the gti in the spotlight [/ QUOTE ] But then I've seen the GTI get 6.7s 0-60 in roadtests. So VW's quoted 7.2s is also a bit conservative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neimad Posted April 28, 2006 Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 [ QUOTE ] The mag states that the 0-60 figures given by VW are purposely incorrect, and that it's actually the same as the gti according to their results. They suppose vw did this to keep the gti in the spotlight [/ QUOTE ] Sorry but I don't buy it. The GT-TSI has ~30hp less power and ~40nm less torque than the GTI, and it will only be marginally lighter than the GTI. That's not to say it's slow, or that the GTI is beyond beating, just that I don't believe that VW even needed to artificially adjust the figures for the GT to protect the GTI. What I really don't understand is the pricing (at least in the UK) -- £18k for the 140hp GT-TSI and £19k for the 140hp GT-TDI -- that's a whole lot of money when you consider that a Ford Focus ST1 costs only £17.5k. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olliblue Posted April 28, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 True, In Belgium, a GT TDI with the same spec as a GTI will cost more! (in my case 300£) Not to forget that tax on diesel cars here is double compared to petrol cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mezzanine Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 In the Greek EVO magazine the GT produced 185bhp and performance was very close to the GTi. Only difference in terms of setup is that the GTi wears stiffer absorbers. Here in Greece the GT is priced 24.000 euros and the GTi 30.000 euros, the difference is very big for almost the same car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie_d Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 Remember that the diesel will be heavier and this extra weight will be up front. This means that not only will it need more power to be as fast as the GTI, but it will also understeer more due to the weight over the front wheels. Add this to the more frequent gear changes that a diesel requires and you will have a slower car, although the diesel will still be damn quick. Put it this way; I've gone from a MKIV diesel (182bhp/301lb/ft) to the GTI and on familiar roads the GTI is much, much quicker. Obviously part of this will be down to the better chassis with the MKV, but most is down to the characteristics of a petrol engine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mezzanine Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 i'm talking about the GT 1.4 TSi. It's 70 kilos lighter than the GTi and all this is above the front wheels. With aftermarket absorbers (bilstein sport) this baby should turn quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMC950 Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 If the GT has a heavier engine, that will help with traction under acceleration (weight over the driving wheels) and therefore give it a good 0-60 time. But the extra front end weight will encourage it to go straight on at the 1st corner... a bit like the R32 then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metalex Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 [ QUOTE ] In the Greek EVO magazine the GT produced 185bhp and performance was very close to the GTi. Only difference in terms of setup is that the GTi wears stiffer absorbers. Here in Greece the GT is priced 24.000 euros and the GTi 30.000 euros, the difference is very big for almost the same car. [/ QUOTE ] Doesn't the GTI also have a wider track? The GT may produce 185bhp, but I've seen figures where the GTI is also producing more than VW quote. I've seen up to at least 212bhp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mezzanine Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 [ QUOTE ] Doesn't the GTI also have a wider track? The GT may produce 185bhp, but I've seen figures where the GTI is also producing more than VW quote. I've seen up to at least 212bhp. [/ QUOTE ] No the track should be the same. The GTi outperforms the GT in acceleration after 140kmh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie_d Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 [ QUOTE ] i'm talking about the GT 1.4 TSi. It's 70 kilos lighter than the GTi and all this is above the front wheels. With aftermarket absorbers (bilstein sport) this baby should turn quick. [/ QUOTE ] Ah, that one, yeah, that'll be quick. Although you can't really compare a modded GT with the standard GTI, as I could just turn around and compare a remapped GTI with the GT... Although apparently the GT can be pretty tastily remapped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoopy Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 Im not into this 0-60mph thing its not a true figure imho as it so depends on a good start, traction, test driver, etc etc. Better to look at 30-70 through gears and maybe even 0-100mph if you must look at a 0-figure. You can get low 0-60 figures with correct gearing. Cars like the old pug 205 XT/XS were always close to there GTI models but after 60 the figures were nowere near. They were huge differences to 100mph for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie_d Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 Snoopy> Totally mate, some cars are designed so 60 is reached in 2nd gear and therefore negates another time sapping gear change. 1/4 miles figures are where it really tells (for straight line speed) imho. I followed a mate in his E36 M3 the other day and from about 30 to 70 it was pretty close, he was quicker but not much in it really. But from 70 to a figure higher than 70 he demolished me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fresco1 Posted May 5, 2006 Report Share Posted May 5, 2006 [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Fuel economy on the GTI isn't terrible - around 30-31mpg with 50% motorway and 50% town for me. The diesel 0-60 is in the 8 second zone I believe. As for smiles... mate you just wouldn't believe the satisfaction owning a GTI gives you... so what if it's a few grand more than a GT, it's so feckin' worth it! [/ QUOTE ] I currently average ~45mpg and around 350-400 miles from the 45 litre tank in my 1.4litre VW Polo, so believe me when I say that when I get the GTI it's going to be a culture shock... in more than one way. I have no doubt that I'll enjoy every minute of owning a GTI, I just hope that the fuel bills and other associated costs don't force me to part company with it earlier than anticipated. [/ QUOTE ] Have a pic on my phone of computer while sitting in traffic the other night - 7.1mpg average (not instantaneous reading!) At 103.9p per litre (Shell Optimax at rip-off station ... )... ouch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentandy Posted May 6, 2006 Report Share Posted May 6, 2006 Beat this for an hours driving then: ...unfortunately the average speed taken over exactly an hour sitting in the car when that picture was taken was 1mph! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fresco1 Posted May 6, 2006 Report Share Posted May 6, 2006 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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