RedRobin Posted November 13, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2006 Hmm....My understanding is that it's things like braided hoses with high performance fluid and the appropriate pads (Ferodo DS2500 are now well established) which can make the difference in brake performance. Drilled discs can be a problem but I don't think that AP Racing would agree with you about their groove design being a problem - IIRC there are also other factors involving the disc construction. My AP brake kit has been designed for fast road use rather than for full competition. I have now spent two full afternoons with AP's Senior Engineer and been given a very thorough tour of their premises and I am totally confident in their products. This team is at the cutting edge of brake and clutch products for F1 and have been for many years and with most of the leading F1 teams. I'm not saying that AP Racing are the one and only good brake producer but they must be amongst the very best. So far, I just can't fault these brakes no matter what I have thrown at them (so far) and I have had three real-world 'moments' where I have felt seriously glad of their very even and effective stopping power. The pedal feel and response is perfect imo. It should be noted though that I am not a highly experienced racing driver and so my judgement can only be based on road driving and neither am I trained. I do have years of very focussed driving experience though and am offering opinions based on comparisons with the GTI OEM brakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRobin Posted November 13, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2006 Hi Rich > Whose brake kit are you planning to use on your .:R? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rs32 Posted November 13, 2006 Report Share Posted November 13, 2006 [ QUOTE ] Hi Rich > Whose brake kit are you planning to use on your .:R? [/ QUOTE ] OEM parts (VAG group) - and with a twist I did think about pink calipers but realised people may get confused and assume RR has bought an .:R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazerblue Posted November 13, 2006 Report Share Posted November 13, 2006 Congratulations RR on your new brakes & very informative review Think you might have mentioned b4 in previous post's but what is the price of the upgrade for mere mortal's who do not have the AP racing guru to fit them & does the 4 pot set up fit the standard 17" wheels ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petsy Posted November 13, 2006 Report Share Posted November 13, 2006 the 17" rims will work with that big brake kit as RR will attest to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRobin Posted November 13, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2006 ....Price to mere mortals is around £1,700 but I think that may be without fitting. Yes, they fit the GTI's standard BBS 17": Photographed while still on the ramp and without all wheelnuts. And a slightly nicer pic: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazerblue Posted November 13, 2006 Report Share Posted November 13, 2006 [ QUOTE ] ....Price to mere mortals is around £1,700 but I think that may be without fitting. Yes, they fit the GTI's standard BBS 17": Photographed while still on the ramp and without all wheelnuts. And a slightly nicer pic: [/ QUOTE ] Nice alloy's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRobin Posted November 13, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2006 They're my original 17s which I still have, but I much prefer my 18s. 17s versus 18s has been a hotly discussed subject as you can doubtless imagine! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cagey Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] However, I wonder just what spec the Cupra's brakes will be - Grooved disks? Braided hoses? Dot fluid? DS2500 pads? How big the discs? etc. [/ QUOTE ] 345x30 iirc, prob normal hoses as braided are not liked by automotive companys hard to spot rubber hose problems. Fluid prob standard, pads who knows but are special for that model. Discs are normally stadard type not grooved, grooved and also drilled are known to crack with age so again not liked by OEM. [/ QUOTE ] Sorry to be really picky about this, but stainless braided hoses have a PTFE (Teflon) inner. This is impervious to pretty much any fluid, has a melting point of around 204 degrees C, and has a whole lot less expansion than a 'rubber' hose has. And if you're talking 'rubber', it needs to be an EPDM compound, otherwise the brake (or clutch) fluid will eat through it. One other thing, if you get braided lines, ask if the inner is 'carbon lined'. This will avoid a build-up of static which can potentially spike through the line, making a pin-prick hole - never good in a brake line. I've been contemplating making my own lines up - just need to get the car jacked up to have a look. Again, sorry to be anal about it, but it's my job... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cagey Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Oh, forgot to say - that kit looks top quality and from what Red is saying, seems a big improvement over OEM. I've always thought the pedal to be a bit wooden, so it sounds like a really worthwhile mod. Now, where DID I leave that £1700..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRobin Posted November 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 [ QUOTE ] so how much do you want for her then? [/ QUOTE ] ....£35K, and you won't get delivery until the replacement GTI for me is delivered . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RRR250 Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Hi Red had the AP 4pots fitted along with morego 250 and power grip and what you said is spot on. They feel like they're trying to pull you out of the seat. Only probs with the DS2500 is the amout of brakes dust so no pronlem at all really.Glad to have found some like minded people at last on other forums they seem more bothered about MPG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRobin Posted November 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 RRR > If I didn't say so already: A Very Warm Welcome to Tyresmoke - We are a motley crew but all enthusiastic about our various cars. Be prepared for lots of banter but also very real support if/when you get problems. Check out the other forums here on TSN too . So, you've got exactly the same AP brakes as me? Fronts only? I noticed my wheels getting dirtier more quickly! Brake dust. The Ferodo DS2500 is very highly thought of for fast road use and occasional track days even. It's also important to match the right pad with the disc - Too many 'boy-racers' think that just having drilled discs and racing pads is the answer to brake performance. The choice of fluid is important too. So, you like your Morego re-map? [i'm sure you do!!] Manual or DSG?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RRR250 Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Thanks for the welcome sorry should have said hello. Hello. Its says formula kit for MKV on box and looks the same as your's.Had them fitted at morego and they ordered them for me. Couldn't agree more the Ferodos are very good had them fitted to a subaru in the past and was impressed. I've got a DSG with MF wheel and yes I do like the Morego 250. Didn't have the APs done at same time as the re-map but felt they were a good idea! You have done it the right way round, brakes are always the best mod.The APs really are an amazing piece of kit. Didn't realise they were lighter than standard. You said you have changed your induction what have you gone for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRobin Posted November 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 [ QUOTE ] You said you have changed your induction what have you gone for? [/ QUOTE ] ....Carbonio Cold Air Intake - See thread: HERE Improves torque and efficiency of air in and exhaust gases out. My VW dealer was happy to fit it so my VW warranty was still protected. Neuspeed solution would effect warranty cos of change of engine cover. I see no point doing it unless you have a performance exhaust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muppetboy Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 [ QUOTE ] Glad to have found some like minded people at last on other forums they seem more bothered about MPG. [/ QUOTE ] This has been a hot topic on here too, we cover all aspects of ownership Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashleywater Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Hi Red Thinking I might go for this conversion on the 30th Ani when it turns up, as after driving the R, the gti grabbers feel a tad under rated. The addition of an extra 30 ponies is not going to improve matters. Who do I contact and where are they? to get some fitted. What are we looking at cost wise, and how long does the conversion take? Cheers, FA.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazerblue Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 [ QUOTE ] Hi Red had the AP 4pots fitted along with morego 250 and power grip and what you said is spot on. They feel like they're trying to pull you out of the seat. Only probs with the DS2500 is the amout of brakes dust so no pronlem at all really.Glad to have found some like minded people at last on other forums they seem more bothered about MPG. [/ QUOTE ] Hi RRR Welcome to TSN Glad you like the the Morego 250 and AP Brakes. There pretty much top of my shopping list when my Gti's arrives and is run in. BTW. Did you go for the Powergrip suspension kit? If so what are your thoughts... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRobin Posted November 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Some more info on the Ferodo DS2500 pads: DS2000 Primarily used for High Performance Road applications, this material combines racing material performance together with the immediate response needed for today's road. The material works at a high co-efficient of friction 0.46 and will not fade up to 650°C. Typical Applications: - High Performance Road Cars, Group N Cars, rear applications of front drive Super Touring Cars. DS2500 This is a relatively new material designed to bridge the gap between DS2000 and DS3000. For use on both light and heavy High Performance cars it contains all the benefits of DS2000 but with less pad noise and a 'racing pedal feel'. It is disc friendly and has 20% less pad wear than competitive products: Typical Applications: - High Performance Road Cars. DS3000 This is a race material with coefficient friction of 0.62 from cold up to 750°C, which provides predictable braking and pedal feel as well as exceptional fade resistance and consistent bite. Typical Applications: - Rally and Race - i.e. Single Seaters, Group N, Touring Saloon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRobin Posted November 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 [ QUOTE ] Who do I contact and where are they? to get some fitted. What are we looking at cost wise, and how long does the conversion take? Cheers, FA [/ QUOTE ] ....List of AP dealers and distributors: HERE They will advise you of costs. Approx £1,700 incl VAT but excluding fitting which takes 2-3 hours plus road testing afterwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarmac_Terrorist Posted November 14, 2006 Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Are the brakes any noisier at low (stop & start) speeds. My standard GTI brakes seem very noisy...not sure why Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRobin Posted November 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2006 Providing you bed the discs and pads in as instructed, you shouldn't experience any noise. What kind of noises are your OEM brakes making, TT? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarmac_Terrorist Posted November 15, 2006 Report Share Posted November 15, 2006 It just sounds like the pads are made of a very coarse / hard material. They're not grinding in any way (got me thinking now!). I very carefully 'ran' the car in until 1200 miles and I haven't driven it hard enough to glaze the pads. Maybe I should get it checked out - I assumed it was just a charactoristic of the car... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petsy Posted November 15, 2006 Report Share Posted November 15, 2006 hmm, I would get that checked out as my car doesn't do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oli Posted November 15, 2006 Report Share Posted November 15, 2006 Congrats RR, they look and sound the biz. TT beat me to it - are they noisey, as when I drove the heavily modded R32(that's in next months VW DRIVER), the brakes were noisey as hell, squealing all the time, but they were 996 items, I think. I am finding the R32 brakes so much better than the GTI, no wooden feeling at all, and from my memory when I drove Si Burt's GTI, the brakes were awesome. RS32 - Are you still going for the RS4 brakes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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