Frodo Posted July 20, 2008 Report Share Posted July 20, 2008 I am thinking of renewing my photography hobby and want to buy a new DSLR camera. A few things I am looking for: - Versatility - Good range of quality lenses - Lightweight - An ability to point and shoot when necessary Budget < £500 My step-daughter is showing a very good eye for photography and I would like to encourage this and teach her how to use a camera (hence the need for lightweight). What is the general feeling? The D80 is at the very limit of my budget but is it worth it over the D60? What is the practical difference between the Canon 400/450? Any current bundles that include a good body and wide-angle to telescopic, 18-200 ish? Cheers, Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarMad Posted July 20, 2008 Report Share Posted July 20, 2008 Biased I know but I'd look at the Canon's seen a lot on other forums about Nikon camera build quality issues. The 400d and new 450d have won plenty of awards and the reviews of the new 450d are excellent really rating the image quality. Plus the range of lenses at ALL price ranges is far better than Nikon even without factoring in the Sigma / Tokina etc. lenses. Just been out with mine today at a BBQ with the 30mm f1.4 and taken some cracking shots, enjoying the hobbie more and more and even on holiday having an SLR wasn't a shore and made taking photos and the later quality showing people afterwards a pleasure. Get stuck in and get one bought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwo Posted July 21, 2008 Report Share Posted July 21, 2008 D80 is a pretty heavy (meaty) but a cracking camera - i have just brought one although looked at all of the options. nikon v canon abit like audi v bmw! personal preference! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frodo Posted July 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 21, 2008 Thanks for the comments I am tending towards the Canon 450D. Just need to find the best package Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jez Posted July 21, 2008 Report Share Posted July 21, 2008 Thanks for the comments I am tending towards the Canon 450D. Just need to find the best package One of the differences between the 400D and 450D is the switch to SD & SDHC from compact flash, all previous canon DSLR's were compact flash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarMad Posted July 21, 2008 Report Share Posted July 21, 2008 Thanks for the comments I am tending towards the Canon 450D. Just need to find the best package Warehouse express seems to have some good deals and you can do an interest free pay later thing if you want to. Not been looking at any where else though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m4ttm4son Posted July 21, 2008 Report Share Posted July 21, 2008 After the advice I got here, I got myself a 400D and am very happy with it. Taken lots of pics and am starting to get used to what all the settings do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GCab Posted July 22, 2008 Report Share Posted July 22, 2008 (edited) Interesting - I've just started looking at this. I met a guy with a Canon 40D (not 400D) at a wedding and he made the point that the cheaper 'consumer' models, although sold as entry-level, have a more menu-based system which actually slows down your learning - he originally had a 450D (I think) but upgraded to the 40D in less than a year because he found the more semi-pro one let you alter settings much more responsively and directly via buttons on the shell, rather than delving into menus. He wished he'd bought the more expensive one earlier and was pushing the line that actually having the higher-end camera was better for learning on, as it was more like the old film cameras and had less "software driving" involved. I must admit this kind of grabbed me, because I do fancy something more tactile and quick-response even though I'm a beginner - one reason I want to move up from pocket digicams is the endless poking about on tiny menu screens, and to get more hands-on control. Have any views on this, m4ttamson? Good to know yours works well for you, maybe I should copy you but I was eying up the 40D on his say-so - it struck a chord with me because I've got more Luddite over the years and prefer buttons to soft menus. Edited July 22, 2008 by GCab Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GCab Posted July 22, 2008 Report Share Posted July 22, 2008 D80 is a pretty heavy (meaty) but a cracking camera - i have just brought one although looked at all of the options. nikon v canon abit like audi v bmw! personal preference! Yes, I was a bit surprised at the 'build quality' comment, I thought Nikon were actually supposed to be more solidly made. I suppose it depends on model and price point - they each seem to fit their products into each others' gaps (rather than having directly competing models like BMW 3 vs Audi A4), so if you compare a 'consumer' Nikon with a 'pro-sumer' Canon (or vice versa) then the results might vary. I certainly didn't think Nikon were a cheapo build brand, though. How's yours, jwo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidicks Posted July 22, 2008 Report Share Posted July 22, 2008 Well I bought a 400D for our trip to South Africa in 2006, it came with an 18-55mm lens and then we bought a Canon 70-300mm digital stabilising lens as well. Some of the pictures we have are incredible, and for me it offers a great compromise between wanting something to leave in ’automatic’ mode for most of the time, and having the ability to change things manually to create certain effects etc. Highly recommended! Sidicks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarMad Posted July 22, 2008 Report Share Posted July 22, 2008 I had a play with a 400d and a 40d before I decided, both are great cameras but the 40d felt like it was made of granite and was great in the hands. The 400d felt like a toy in comparison, light and much smaller. The 40d with a larger lens is very well weighted and is a joy to use. As you say all the setting and things to change are very easy to hand in a hurry and I don't really use the menus for very much at all except for some obscure settings I might play with from time to time. Grab hold of one in a shop side by side and see what you think yourself. I carry mine in a Crumpler Prettyboy bag most of the time when not taking shots for a while so its never a problem to keep with me and not get heavy. Was great to take shots with in Rome, Florence and Barcelona on the honeymoon and the wife didn't get miffed at any point with me taking shots either. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GCab Posted July 22, 2008 Report Share Posted July 22, 2008 and the wife didn't get miffed at any point with me taking shots either. :D Well, you were on honeymoon so she hardly complain... :assfecking: Oh, or did you mean with the camera? :flush: Anyway (ahem) interesting to hear - backed up what the other guy I met at the wedding was saying. Now the thing for me is, Carmad, did you get into 'proper' photography via the 40D direct, or did you go through a whole 'upgrade route' by starting with something more entry-level and working up like you're "supposed" to? I'm asking because I'm really thinking (m4tt4mson's and other people's good experiences with 400/450 etc. notwithstanding) of either the 40D or even the Nixon D300, which is really getting into the high-end market. I like these for the direct-control aspects, but what I'm expecting is that I'm going to go into a shop to try one out, or ask about it here, and I'm going to get the sort of looks/comments that people give someone buying a really expensive set of golf clubs before learning to play. But I really do want to learn on something which doesn't have me rummaging about in a back-screen menu using one 4-way rocker and delete button, otherwise I could just stick with a pocket camera. The 40D and D300 sound as if I could get to grips with them and learn a lot without menu-driven irritation (though not without challenge), even though I'm expecting some silent "more money than sense" mockery from the salesman when I ask try one out and he asks what I normally use ("er, a disposable?"). So - did you buy a 40D as your first or am I mad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarMad Posted July 22, 2008 Report Share Posted July 22, 2008 Straight in at the 40d its a Pro-sumer model if I went for a 5d or 1d then it would be silly. For the same reasons you are mentioning I was told the 40d gave you so much more in relation to what a pro might use and would add to my pleasure of taking good photos and having photography as a hobby. A colleague at work is an avid photographer and game me loads of advice. Its him that said go to a shop and feel them side by side and ignore the specs it means nothing. Sure enough when I felt them both the 40d was the way to go and as it happened I picked one up via a member of TSN that was nearly new and hardly used. 6 months on I've got 3 lens and looking to get more but really am enjoying it, even more than I thought I would. The 40d feels like a quality piece of kit and I'm sure adds to the enjoyment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarMad Posted July 22, 2008 Report Share Posted July 22, 2008 She had no complains on either by the way thanks :assfecking: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frodo Posted July 22, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 22, 2008 Well had a really crap day in the office today so decided to lighten my mood and spoil myself. Purchased a Canon 450D from WarehouseExpress. Looking forward to getting it and re-learning the art Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwo Posted July 24, 2008 Report Share Posted July 24, 2008 GCab I have had the D80 for about one month now - it is cracking, picture quality really good - 400 taken so far (selected highest quality image size etc. sandisk extreme III 4gb card - £17.99), lens is good only nikon standard 28-135 that came with camera (effectively 35-200 on a digital slr), haven't tried it with my onther lenses yet as i am too lazy! Battery life is phenomenal, nikon say 2,700 shot per charge compared to 500 for the d60. I like the weight and build quality of the nikon, meaty, well built 'solid' etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gizze Posted July 25, 2008 Report Share Posted July 25, 2008 I like the Nikon cameras, and had a D300 for a while, took over 5000 frames with it and in some areas it was great, main problem for me though is I like capturing people, and most often this is indoors and quite a lot of the time at night, and there is no fast prime lens for the Nikons that is not silly money. The canons have the 28mm f/1.8 USM for qapprox. £300 and the 35mm f/2.0 for around £170, which both allow you to shoot people in low light with no flash and without having to crank the iso up (which brings in noise). Although the Nikon was nice, I was very releived when it packed up and warehouse express didn't have any instock, I got a refund. I have a 400d and combined with the 28mm f/1.8 I would say it covers 90% of my photography, it is small, unobtrusive and gives some stunning results. The 40d does have more features on the camera, but the main things I use are iso, f stop and white balance and these are all one the 400d with one button. I have sold my 20d as it didn't get enough use, it is bigger and better built but that is also its downfall. So it got left behind, it is too big, that size I would want a FF sensor so it will be a 5D MKII or whatever it is called. The 400d is doing a grand job though and for £350 for the kit and £50 for the 50mm f/1.8 you can't really go wrong. I would get one of these to start with and then think about a 5D if you feel the need for the next level, you will get £300 back on it 6 months down the road if you want to upgrade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gizze Posted July 25, 2008 Report Share Posted July 25, 2008 Should just add, the only reason I would buy the 40d over the 400/450 is spot metering, to not include it is a crime imho. But you get used to not having it, and if you have never had it before than you won't know what you are missing anyway. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted July 25, 2008 Report Share Posted July 25, 2008 One of our pro's went from a 1D to a Nikon D3, and whilst the skin tones with the Nikon D3 were superb, we both thought the punchiness (made up word!) of colours on the Canon were better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gizze Posted July 25, 2008 Report Share Posted July 25, 2008 I agree, the D3 is a technical marvel, but I am not the biggest fan of the images for mere mortals. For those with some superb Nikon glass it shines, but still prefer the overall image of the Canons with L glass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m4ttm4son Posted July 25, 2008 Report Share Posted July 25, 2008 Should just add, the only reason I would buy the 40d over the 400/450 is spot metering, to not include it is a crime imho. But you get used to not having it, and if you have never had it before than you won't know what you are missing anyway. :D Indeed. I have no idea what you're talking about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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