Chav Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 Yes they need to axe them.... not enough cash. ....but this strike will mean a few 1000 more will go than otherwise. I cant remember the cost of the last strike per day, but its staggering. Many more jobs will have to be cut. So explain the logic of the 92.% that voted in favour, 'cos I don't get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mook Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 If a flight is cancelled does the customer get a full refund? Virgin and co should be straining at the leash to accomodate. Yes, they will get a refund, but that's not the issue. A lot of people will have booked weeks or even months ago to get the best rates possible, because they probably only get the chance or can afford to go away once in a blue moon. Booking a flight now will be at full whack and there's fewer places available than are wanted if the flights really are cancelled. IATA are telling everyone to hold out until the end of today to find out the outcome of the discussions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_Bangle Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 According to the Civil Aviation Authority, average costs of BA crew are twice those of their Virgin Atlantic counterparts... ... and that's not including the stay-away bonus. For example, if they do a return flight to Tokyo, it takes 4 days because its classed as a day there, 2 days rest there, and a day back. They obviously get their top hotel paid for, but they also get a stay-away bonus to cover things like meals and entertainment. For that Tokyo trip they are paid and extra £935.00 , that’s over and above their normal wages. A six-day return to Shanghai pays £866, five days to Hong Kong £798 and five days to Rio £731. Think i'll become a trolley dolly ... Well, only if TDK wasn't on the flight! Source: British Airways cabin crew vote for 12-day strike from December 22 - Business Traveller Asia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waylander Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 Oh I get that Mook. What I mean is that it would be a PR Coupe for Virgin to say something like "we will honour anyone with a confirmed booking". It would destroy BA as a force in any meaningful sense in routes they both run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mook Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 But Andy, that's not what the strike is about - ALL cabin crew get stayovers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mook Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 Oh I get that Mook.What I mean is that it would be a PR Coupe for Virgin to say something like "we will honour anyone with a confirmed booking". It would destroy BA as a force in any meaningful sense in routes they both run. I don't think they've got enough planes though, which is a shame. Maybe Virgin Atlantic could hire the jumbos from BA for the duration of the strike, make some money and keep all the now ex BA punters happy :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waylander Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 Actually that was exactly what I was thinking. They have planes and pilots sitting idle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipex Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 Trouble is, while hiring the idle planes would save them a fortune in ground fees, they'd know it would be commercial suicide! What about the people who've booked and paid for holidays? Do they get the full cost of the holiday back or just the flights? What about consequential losses like having used all your holiday pay entitlement, then having to take unpaid holiday at a later date to get your holiday? I'd be wanting to sue each and every one of the selfish tossers that go on strike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
byron13 Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 And people think Bankers are greedy!!! BA made a £292 million loss in the last 6 months!! How can they expect to all keep the same historical contracts in times like these? Cost efficiencies are a must and it seems this all hinges around Heathrow cabin staff not others as they have already agreed to the new terms and have been working as such for a while now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chav Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 pension deficit alone will kill BA (~4BN) if its not careful. i think more drastic measures will come soon!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theduisbergkid Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 Jeremy Vine today was talking about this. Cabin crew based at Sheathrow get paid £29k pa. I know plenty of people who would love that job. Their union (forget which one) already has legal action planned in February, so why the feck go on strike now, before any contractual issues have been formally and legally discussed in court ? Sack every striker. Job done. Selfish feckers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waylander Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 Also as I understood it, the working pattern on the table was one already used by BA at Gatwick so hardly an unsafe untried formula? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
byron13 Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 " The union is protesting at the imposition of changes to crew numbers as well as a pay freeze and plans to introduce different rates of pay and conditions for new crew members. " Pay freeze - Airline is hemorrhaging money (£292 million loss last 6 months) Reduction of staff - works OK at Gatwick and on other airlines (and £292 million loss last 6 months) Diff conditions for new staff - BA cant keep employing people on this package it not in line with the industry (and losing £292 million over the last 6 months) I really don't get it BA are LOSING money you idiots and at this rate will fold with no jobs for anyone (well small bits to other airlines who certainly will not have such good "packages" as now) Memories of the miners strike come to mind here, but at least they had something to moan about I guess even if the supply of coal was totally un cost productive. Can you imagine all the trolley dollys and "smart friendly" young men all fighting on the picket line!! Hairdryers drawn! I used to work for an IT firm that historical has press links and as such some of the staff (many moons ago) enjoyed some very favourable press and printing perks (one example was holiday pay - in some cases up to 40 days accumulated over years) Did my time there and moved on and never had the "old" packages offered or expected. Well it was always the old boys who had the most to moan about their perks being erroded..... Well cut a long story short a few years later said firm culled thousands of the old guard as they just got too expensive to employ and never really seemed to do much anyway. Now performing so much better with a leaner more results rewarded staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mook Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 I wonder how many of the 90+% of people who voted in favour felt pressured to vote yes, whether from the union or from their co-workers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wizbit Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 I wonder how many of the 90+% of people who voted in favour felt pressured to vote yes, whether from the union or from their co-workers. Exactly what I was thinking. I'm sure most of this is because 'everyone else' is doing it and they have to be seen to join in. I say sack the lot of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipex Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 Yep, sack any feckers that don't turn up to work, offer them a new job with new conditions and state they aren't allowed to join a union/union won't be recognised or negotiated with, and worry about it afterwards. I'm pretty sure the vote would be totally anonymous btw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 I wrote some rambling shite on this earlier. If they cripple BA they'll either file for bankruptcy/bankruptcy protection or end up re-financing. Either way they'll face forced redundancy or renegotiation of terms. It just seems ridiculously short-sighted and dumb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muppetboy Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 No news from BA yet on my flights... I'd happily fly without cabin crew, I'll help myself to the nuts and booze! Hell we can have a party.... yeeeeeeeeeHAAAAAAAAAAAA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipex Posted December 15, 2009 Report Share Posted December 15, 2009 Feck, don't give that Ryanair lot ideas, self catering flights? whatever next! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarMad Posted December 16, 2009 Report Share Posted December 16, 2009 Apparently BA Gatwick staff have sent an open letter to the media on their thoughts. They say in the letter that they have been working under the proposed rules for 3 months (I think it is) and the service to the custmer hasn't dropped or the workload radically changed. Their average salaries at Gatwick are far lower at £14,000 and they say at the end of the letter that they think that Heathrow staff should 'Wake up and smell the coffee and stop trying to destroy the company'. I can't find the letter itself yet but it's certainly interesting that even other people in the same company don't support the action. Fingers crossed BA win the court case today to get the strike stopped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
byron13 Posted December 16, 2009 Report Share Posted December 16, 2009 Apparently BA Gatwick staff have sent an open letter to the media on their thoughts. They say in the letter that they have been working under the proposed rules for 3 months (I think it is) and the service to the custmer hasn't dropped or the workload radically changed. Their average salaries at Gatwick are far lower at £14,000 and they say at the end of the letter that they think that Heathrow staff should 'Wake up and smell the coffee and stop trying to destroy the company'. I can't find the letter itself yet but it's certainly interesting that even other people in the same company don't support the action. Fingers crossed BA win the court case today to get the strike stopped. Good on them - glad to know some sensible workers left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waylander Posted December 16, 2009 Report Share Posted December 16, 2009 Some lawyers on 5Live last night said that was all but impossible based the premise of BA's case Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_Bangle Posted December 16, 2009 Report Share Posted December 16, 2009 No news from BA yet on my flights... When my flights were cancelled I was sent a link in an email instructing me to choose new one's (different day/times/route) for the same price. I just asked for a refund instead. The majority of cancelled flights will be domestic and then European. Long haul should be okey as I reckon with even with a 90%+ call for strike there will be a enough cabin crew to work those instead of missing out on all thier OT & Bonuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theduisbergkid Posted December 16, 2009 Report Share Posted December 16, 2009 The majority of cancelled flights will be domestic and then European. There can't be many domestic BA flights left ? They flogged off many to FlyBe, Eastern Airways, BMI and so on as I recall. Teachers / Postal workers / Peugeot Ryton / Miners / Firemen / Vauxhall Luton... I can't recall a strike where there was ever a positive long term outcome for the workers, and certainly never for the customers. Sack 'em. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DHA Posted December 16, 2009 Report Share Posted December 16, 2009 BA still has a fair sized domestic operation from LHR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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