garcon magnifique Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 Being Scottish and therefore stupid (and used to losing) you've completely missed the point. Well, my point anyway. The voting process isn't merely flawed, it's blatantly corrupt. And yes, to my mind it would be just as blatantly corrupt had England won. I'm not one of those blinkered jingoistic morons who thought England had it in the bag and "deserved" to win. My dignity is fully intact knowing that I support the freedom of our media to uncover bribery and corruption, all the more so now it seems our media coverage DID have an impact on the vote. Hopefully the media pressure will not let up, several FIFA executives will be shown up for what they really are, and we will rule out any further bids until FIFA is cleaned. To lose dignity would have been to collude with the corrupt machine just so we can grab a piece of the FIFA circus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mook Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 Being Scottish and therefore stupid (and used to losing) you've completely missed the point. Bob, feel free to call him a **** if you want Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuprabob Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 Being Scottish and therefore stupid (and used to losing) you've completely missed the point.Well, my point anyway. The voting process isn't merely flawed, it's blatantly corrupt. And yes, to my mind it would be just as blatantly corrupt had England won. I'm not one of those blinkered jingoistic morons who thought England had it in the bag and "deserved" to win. My dignity is fully intact knowing that I support the freedom of our media to uncover bribery and corruption, all the more so now it seems our media coverage DID have an impact on the vote. Hopefully the media pressure will not let up, several FIFA executives will be shown up for what they really are, and we will rule out any further bids until FIFA is cleaned. To lose dignity would have been to collude with the corrupt machine just so we can grab a piece of the FIFA circus. Yes, we're used to losing but are not stupid. In fact I find being called stupid offensive. FYI, I never even read your post therefore my comments were not directed specifically at you. I appreciate you're view is slightly different to the majority and the process is corrupt but the majority would have accepted the "corrupt" result if they the bid had won. In addition, if Russia had acted in the same may if England had won, they would have been seen as "bad losers" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon magnifique Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 (edited) Ok, stupid's a bit harsh, but you MUST be used to losing.... (Ah, ok, you admitted that bit, moving on... ) And I agree entirely with your points about the jingoistic morons throughout England who are complaining so bitterly about the result. I never wanted the bloody thing anyway - 8 years of "football's coming home" might even have forced me to move to Scotland! Edited December 3, 2010 by garcon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mook Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 might even have forced me to move to Scotland! Poor Scots... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon magnifique Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 Poor Scots... Don't you start... It's not my fault they're poor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuprabob Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 Yes, sadly we are used to losing although all that experience allows us to do it with some dignity+++ Sadly, even if you moved up here you would still be exposed to 8 years of "footballs coming home" as we've even got TVs up here too. In fact, didn't we invent them It sounds as though we're not too far apart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mook Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 we've even got TVs up here too Bloody hell - you'll be moving over to those horseless carriages next Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waylander Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 Whilst I accept I may be missing something, the (expected) vitriol in the backlash today seems to have missed the woods for the trees on a number of levels. 1) That Russia won should not really be a focus of question. Up until Putin announcing he was not coming (and his comments should have alerted people to the general Ex-Co mood) they were considered the main serious contender to England. The conspiracy theories about Spain-Bharain pacts have been shown to be nonsense as well. 2) This self-righteous hogwash about the "Freedom of the British Press" - what a smokescreen! No-one has questioned the Press' right to investigate any and all of the stories but they have been handled in tactless ways and the timing of the Panorama programme (given that they had the info a while ago) was pure mischief and stupidity on the part of the Beeb and should be deservedly castigated. Whilst it probably didn't "lose" the bid by itself it obviously fanned the disquiet already present. 3) Regarding the gifts story as well. We all (thanks to the boy Warner) knew about the "inappropriate" handbags to the wives - it was reported thus in our media. Why did they not report it properly then instead of harming the England bid with the way they presented it? Again they must question their own actions rather than hide behind "freedom of the English press...Bahrain, Russia blah blah" nonsense. 4) There was a steady drip-drip of negative press (from our own media) hindering the bid by our own media (inc Triesman). Whilst all this stuff certainly needed to be flagged, one must not ignore the harm it did to the national interest. 5) That we lost as I said should not be relevant. The fact we only got 1 outside vote should be the main story and one that should be robustly reviewed: -what is the basis of the alleged briefing of Ex-Co by Blatter just before the vote? (as claimed by a number of sources in Japan member)? -Conversely it highlights that whilst the technical apsects of the bid may have been sound it demonstrates utter incompetence in the bid team in managing the personal aspects of the bid - Cameron/Bekham and Will flying in at the last minute is not going to undo the long-term shmoozing done by all other bids. Indeed that the final England presentation "helped" should not have been something to get happy about, it should have sounded alarm bells about how badly we are being viewed up to that point and question the veracity of the supposedly votes "in the bag" 6) What is with the bashing of Qatar? US already had a world cup and it has helped develope MLS. Australia is very remote and commercial aspects may have been harmed. Middle East has oodles of cash, does have a football culture but it needs to be developed; commercial rights would be lucrative; they plan to donate the grounds to 3rd world countries after the event. Sounds like a good plan to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mook Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 You, Mr Waylander, sir, talk a lot of sense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billy2shots Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 Bob I'm not sure anyone here is saying its not fair because England lost, we are saying the way the result was achieved is wrong and unfair. Why spend time visiting each county and documenting positive and negative points when they hold no sway in how the final decision is made. England were criticised for poor training facilities that they since rectified yet Russia haven't even built 75% of their facilities. This is just one of many examples. To be honest my problem is not Russia its Qatar that I can't believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon magnifique Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 No-one is seriously questioning press freedom in here, but out there, in the wider world of the Jingoistic English Moron (JEM - is that a new name for chav?) they are. Apparently it's entirely the BBC's fault we didn't win the bid. It was ours to win and the BBC scuppered it on purpose because they're a bunch of nation hating socialists or something. F*cking w*nkers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waylander Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 Maybe so Garcon but you cannot absolve the Beeb of blame either. They sought to time the programme for most viewing impact and it did have a detrimental effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon magnifique Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 Personally I'm glad it did. Meanwhile, elsewhere on the interweb .... Russia! If only we knew they were looking for an arctic wasteland with a useless transport system and institutional racism for the World Cup.We should've put in a joint bid with Scotland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon magnifique Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 In more news, there's already talk of potential shortages in Qatar in 2022, including camels for transport. England have said if they qualify they'll be taking their own donkeys. Although locals are looking forward to the World Cup 2022 legacy, in particular some cracking new stadiums for stoning women in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipex Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 even got TVs up here too. In fact, didn't we invent them No, they were invented in Hastings.* *by a scot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruiser647 Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 The 'fact-finding' trips are just basically a jolly. They have no need to all visit the countries. Sit them infront of a monitor, send a local lad around each area and film it - show it back. Job done. The voting process needs to be more open. Same with the old Olympic Committee venue selection process - that was flawed. Now it seems (emphasis on seems) to be cleaner but still open to abuse. Would I say the same if England won? Probably not - but I would still feel the same, just not as vocal about it. England need to go and win in 2018 now - just to piss Blatter/Platini off a bit more! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milo Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 I think it's right the World Cup goes to countries who are struggling to develop grassroots football and are looked upon by the rest of the world as being a bit backward when it comes to football. Qatar being a very good example. So when is it Scotland's turn to host it? :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuprabob Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 Personally I'm glad it did.Meanwhile, elsewhere on the interweb .... Liking that a lot:roflmao: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuprabob Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 I think it's right the World Cup goes to countries who are struggling to develop grassroots football and are looked upon by the rest of the world as being a bit backward when it comes to football. Qatar being a very good example.So when is it Scotland's turn to host it? :D Very good:roflmao: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewNiceMrMe Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 Well I've forgotten about it all now. FIFA are corrupt, we knew that. Russia are too, we knew that. Qatar will be a disaster, I think that's pretty much nailed on. So, time for a more light hearted note. Did anyone see The Sun headline today? "PARTNERS IN SLIME" with this picture: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewNiceMrMe Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 It's kicking off again.... Garcon will love this one. Acting Football Association chairman Roger Burden has withdrawn his application for the permanent post over England's 2018 World Cup vote failure. Burden, who was appointed in May, says he can no longer trust Fifa members after England lost out to Russia. "I recognise that an important part of the role is liaison with Fifa, our global governing body," he said. "I am not prepared to deal with people whom I cannot trust and I have withdrawn my candidacy." Burden, who took the post after the resignation of Lord Triesman following what he called his "entrapment" by a national newspaper, said he would remain as acting chairman until a successor could be found. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon magnifique Posted December 4, 2010 Report Share Posted December 4, 2010 Bwahahahahaha. What he means is he's realised FIFA are in an entirely different corruption league to the FA and he's not sure he can keep up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruiser647 Posted December 4, 2010 Report Share Posted December 4, 2010 What he means is he's realised FIFA are in an entirely different corruption league to the FA and he's not sure he can keep up. Correct. When (if) Blatter retires, then the riches will roll in for him. All the promises made to him from World Cups' of yore....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewNiceMrMe Posted December 5, 2010 Report Share Posted December 5, 2010 Possibly the best footballing persons assessment of the result that I have seen, from Sir Alex of all people: "The insult is that the bid only got two votes. Once you have got committees that are impenetrable you have to get on with it. It’s possible that England won’t put in another bid until the system is changed." "My assessment was that England had a good chance because the infrastructure is good, it’s easy to travel and the stadiums are fantastic. England has the best league in Europe and has a great fan base." "What they have to do now is to hold up their heads and know they have done their best. There is no point in taking it any further now.” "My experience of committees tells me that one or two personalities can sway the rest. They are more powerful than the rest. It’s always been the case, whether it’s been football, politics or business." "I don’t think it’s worth having an inquest. What good can it do? England have got to move on. They know they have done their best." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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