Boxing thread

[Andrew]

This Joshua bloke seems like he could be a real asset to British sport. Not just by being good, but by being a sound guy, respectful and humble. I like his comments so far.

In the days you could watch Tyson fights on the BBC I sem to recall some big matches which were over in about 3 rounds. Didn't Spinks succumb in about 90 seconds. Were they all rubbish opponents too?

[NewNiceMrMe]

Mike Tyson's title winning opponents weren't good.  They were of the age when laboured and big lumbering heavyweights dominated.  He came in with speed and anger - and it all changed. 

 

Joshua has huge potential but I worry about all this early hype.  He'll have to make at least one mandatory defence and I think you'll find he takes another opponent after that before he goes for Fury or Haye.  I just hope to god he doesn't pick Haye first.  That fight worries me for some reason.  I think Haye would be a nightmare for Joshua.  The speed and power is there and he's a lot faster in dodging punches and counter punching than anyone else Joshua might face.  I just have a horrible feeling it could all go badly wrong if they choose Haye early (i don't think they will because they're not stupid).

 

AJ could dominate for 4-5 years without issue. 

 

He has everything and you're right, he's a credit to boxing (not just British sport because last night he picked up a lot of plaudits in the USA too).

 

I think he's already said that within minutes of the fight ending he had calls from Showtime and HBO in the states.  The want him over there ASAP.

I'd like to see him fight Wilder.  Because I think he's massively overhyped and AJ would knock him out flat.  That would cement him stateside and he'd become a colossal star.  The world is there for him to take (seriously, Joshua could make as much money or more than Mayweather because of being a heavyweight).

[Soulboy]

Agree with NNMM about Haye and Fury.

Haye is astonishing for a heavyweight. Performs more like a middleweight technically. It would certainly be an explosive match up!

Fury could be a spoiler. Just use his height and reach and sit behind his jab and clinch a lot. Or go Philly Shell. Could end up points winner.

Also wondering about Billys thoughts on money changing hands on Sat. Pro boxing is just so bent and corrupt, it would be plausible.

Amy road up. Well done AJ! British world champion and a nice guy too.

[Soulboy]

I just found and watched the Joshua v Savon from the Olympics again. Shows how much Joshua has improved as a pro.

And the decision! When it's the Olympics AM boxing rivals pro boxing for corrupt judging (remember Roy Jones Jr).

Anyway, see what you think. I love the Cuban boxers. They are taught properly.....hit and don't get hit. Feet first.

https://youtu.be/If-SimfwSXs

I am training two big lads fighting white collar next Sat. How I wish they could learn to move, rather than just go head hunting

[NewNiceMrMe]

When you look at The Ring rankings, there is almost nothing to stop any of the British boxers.

 

The Ring Champion - Tyson Fury

 

Challenger rankings:

 

1. Klitschko

2. Povetkin

3. Wilder

4. Pulev

5. Ortiz

6. Stiverne

7. Jennings

8. Joshua

9. Martin

10. Browne

 

Martin will drop out of that list now.  Browne has tested positive for drugs, so he's gone too.

Wilder is massively over-hyped in my view and I'd love to see Joshua fight him after a mandatory defence.  I think he'll hit the floor with one big punch and that Joshua is too savvy to be caught by his big punches.

Add Haye to the list (on capability I'd have him No.2 in that list.  I'd only give Klitschko top spot on the basis he did beat Haye although I'm convinced the injury was a lot worse than we're told).

I keep harking back to the same thing with Haye.

 

Booth trained him to be cautious.

 

McGuigan is training him to be aggressive.

 

I think Haye's speed and astonishing punching power (forget size, he's still one of the biggest punchers in the game), coupled with Shane's approach, makes him the most dangerous fighter other than Joshua.

 

The fun will start today anyway because someone is going to get a call to ask if they'll fight Joshua.  Can you imagine how many will risk it?

[ashleywater]

 

The Ring Champion - Tyson Fury

 

Challenger rankings:

 

1. Klitschko

2. Povetkin

3. Wilder

4. Pulev

5. Ortiz

6. Stiverne

7. Jennings

8. Joshua

9. Martin

10. Browne

 

 

Not exactly brimming with talent, the new improved banger Haye would beat any of them and so would AJ come to that

 

Where have all the good yank heavies gone?

[billy2shots]

Haye the new improved banger????

As far as I'm aware he has fought one bout since returning and that was against an Ausie club fighter that no tv channel wanted. DAVE had the rights for this fight because it was so comical so I fail to see the evidence of new and improved.

Improvement is a good word though because he will need to do a hell of a lot of improving if he is to be a real challenger, that's unless he can pick his way through a bunch of bums and find himself with the a belt like he did last time.

A very good cruiserweight, a very average heavy.

Edited April 17, 2016 by billy2shots

[NewNiceMrMe]

I couldn't disagree more.

 

I think he's far from an average heavyweight and the fact he took a title and defended it suggests that too.  It is easily forgotten that Haye took the title from a bloke nobody else would fight (including the Klitschko brothers) and he put John Ruiz down in a way nobody had ever done (I'm not saying Ruiz was a brilliant boxer, but he was notoriously hard to stop).

I do agree we don't know much yet though and that's why I disagree that you're calling him average.  He has the speed, the talent and the power.  The big difference now is that he appears to be fully fit (which he certainly wasn't in his last 2 fights previously) and, most importantly, he has a trainer who believes in attack and not boredom.

 

If Joshua fights him too soon, I maintain it'll end in him being KO'd.

[billy2shots]

Joshua won't fight him too soon because Haye doesn't deserve a shot yet.

Haye may have a new trainer (very good one) but he will weave the same route of fighting nobodys and has beens until he artificially works his way up the rankings and gets his shot. Once he has to fight anyone of note he will run for 12 rounds like he has in the past.

Who is he going to fight after this bloke no one has heard of before?

Shannon Briggs lol, he's 72 isn't he???

The money is running low and Haye is desperate for the big pay day. This talk of fighting on free to air tv to give back to the people is lies, it's because Box office won't touch him at the moment. Why would they when he is fighting YMCA class opposition.

If PPV offer him a deal he would turn his back on 'the common man' (his own words) quicker than he ran from Valuev.

Talking of lies do you remember when I said Haye wouldn't retire when he said he would. NNMM was adamant that Haye is a man of his word and would bow out. That was before he went on to fight Harrison, Chisora and his latest comeback.

The guy is full of BS and he has his next excuse ready when he loses.

My toe lol!!!!!!!!!!!

Edited April 17, 2016 by billy2shots

[NewNiceMrMe]

Haye can't afford to weave his way up.  He has 2-3 years.  That's it, at best.

 

He has to fight Briggs because he has to take contenders on that will cause a stir, and Briggs will. 

 

I'd want to shut Briggs up too if I was him.  I can't blame him for wanting to do that.

 

Let's wait and see. 

 

[billy2shots]

It's certainly a better division now than it has been recently that's for sure.

Haye would stand a good chance against Fury imho and that should be his number 1 focus.

Unfortunately I can see Fury beaten by Klit in the rematch.

Haye needs to avoid AJ at all costs (unless that pay day is worth more to him than a victory).

[NewNiceMrMe]

I'm not sure about the Fury v Klitschko rematch.  Part of me thinks Wladimir might win, but another part thinks that Fury is so deep in his head that it won't happen.

 

I can see Fury retiring immediately after the fight anyway.  He's not interested any more and he'll quit because that's the type of person he is. 

 

I see the Haye v AJ fight very differently to you purely because I think it is Joshua who needs to avoid Haye and not the other way around.  Haye has nothing to lose and he's been in with big hitters before.  Joshua has everything to lose and has never met someone with the speed and punching power of Haye.

 

I don't see it happening soon anyway.  Hearn Jnr is now lining up Stiverne as an opponent.  If that doesn't tell you he wants 2-3 defences of the IBF belt for experience purposes before risking a fight with Haye, I don't know what does.

[Tipex]

Fury, what an utter bell end, making his excuses already, massively overweight, says he hates boxing but is too good at it and loves the money.

He's moving to Vegas after the fight apparently, because he gets no respect from the fans here.

Respect needs to be earned, mind the door doesn't hit you on your way out.

[NewNiceMrMe]

His lack of respect for the sport that has made him millions is a disgrace.

 

He also appears to think he's wanted in the USA.  I think he's in for a major surprise.

 

All we can hope is that Klitschko knocks him out and puts an end to a quite appalling reign.  For him to cite the reasons he does for not being liked is beyond hypocrisy.  It borders on, and problem surpasses, a level of lunacy I've not seen for a long time. 

 

He is completely deluded in a way that reminds of Audley Harrison but for all the opposite reasons.  He couldn't see the reality of his own performances and I think Fury fails to see the reality of the offence he creates.  To label himself as being a victim is a remarkable insight into the mind of a man who I think needs to get a grip on the real world but never will.

[eldavo69]

If it was anyone else I'd think it was all mind games and him being really clever. But it's not, it's Tyson Fury.

He thinks he's the next Dan Bilzerian but one of those is already one more than the world needs.

[ashleywater]

On to a true "Gentleman" of the sport

 

Million Dollar

 

I like many others I suspect, understimated him totally ......and I have never been happier to admit I was wrong

 

He has put on two successive masterclasses of boxing and really has propelled himself to World level

 

Ok NNMM who wins Murray v Groves?

 

For me its Murray simply because a bit like Froch he will take Groves to the place he doesn't really like, the championship rounds

 

Kell Brook, WTF is Eddie doing about his career?

[NewNiceMrMe]

Groves beats Murray every day of the week in my opinion.

 

Crolla is superb.  A credit to the sport.

 

I have no idea what is next for Kell Brook although I suspect a fight with Khan is going to happen.

 

Your post is well timed too - because Chris Eubank Jnr has offered to fight Golovkin.  Now that's what you call brave.

[ashleywater]

Groves beats Murray every day of the week in my opinion.

 

Crolla is superb.  A credit to the sport.

 

I have no idea what is next for Kell Brook although I suspect a fight with Khan is going to happen.

 

Your post is well timed too - because Chris Eubank Jnr has offered to fight Golovkin.  Now that's what you call brave.

 

Disagree but we'll see

 

I dont think Khan Brook will happen now as it has lost an awful lot of appeal after Khan's third KO the last one a true lights out job, created by such a basic mistake of dropping the the left guard and sticking his chin out like a golf ball teed up for a driver

 

I mean you have a pretty good  fighter ,but with fairly limited boxing ability, that throws a couple of left hands feints followed by right hands over the top all night, and he drops both his hands and gets chinned

 

As for Eubank Jnr, he is a chip of the old block in that regard

[NewNiceMrMe]

Khan had balls.  He did a terrific job and that KO cannot be compared to any other in his past.  He took on a guy nobody else at his weight would dare to.  I have criticised Khan non-stop for years but he earned a lot of respect from me in that fight. 

 

I think he'd stand a much better chance against Brook than I'd have said previously.

Edited May 20, 2016 by NewNiceMrMe

[Soulboy]

I don't think Khan did too much wrong tbh. Just an exceptional feint and accurate punch from Canello.

Its a high risk shot for Canello.....as the quick rotation of right hip and shoulder to land a big right is fine if it connects.

But if missed, the head passes the lead knee and throws your balance out front....leaving you vulnerable. ...a la Hatton v Mayweather in the corner.

Difficult punch.....well executed.

[NewNiceMrMe]

Indeed.  I think it is very difficult to find any criticism of Khan.

 

A momentary lapse when he was doing so well.  Forget what the judges cards said as they were clearly fixed, but the reality is that Khan was ahead by at least 2 rounds, if not 3, on every single commentators card both here and in the USA. 

 

He was landing and, unlike the Hatton v Mayweather fight (where I thought Cortez was a disgrace), they were allowed to box.

 

Of equal interest is where Canelo goes from here.  Nobody really wants to fight him and a Golovkin match doesn't look close.  I can see Eubank being given a shot at that and, whilst it would be a very risky fight for him, I don't think Golovkin would see it as the easiest of contests.

 

Haye's fight should be a cake walk and I'll be seriously disappointed if he doesn't get a chance of someone worthy soon.  It is very easy for people to say he's trying to gatecrash a party when the reality is that everyone knows he's the riskiest fight they could possibly take.

[Soulboy]

Canelo does the exact same thing he did to Khan against Agulo - 3rd up on this vid.

You can see in the slow mo how Agulo blinds himself to the shot by throwing his own jab.

https://youtu.be/u28rVmrwfOA

James Toney was the master of it. What a truly great boxer he was!

Mayweather learnt from his Philly Shell style.....then improved it.

Edited May 21, 2016 by Soulboy

[Soulboy]

Haye fight was just ridiculous.

No way that guy should have been in the ring at that level.

Worst defence I have ever seen.

Pro boxing can be such a joke sometimes

Edited May 21, 2016 by Soulboy

[Andrew]

I like David Haye. Why was he fighting a bloke who resisted about as much as I would. I might have even done a bit better.

[Andrew]

It has to be hugely frustrating being Haye training like a nutter to get an opponent like that. Feel the same for AJ really.

Here is a question, would you go in the ring against Haye for a payday of £1m? You would probably take a hit and that would be that, KO, but would you do it?