They're really lost it now - £100,000 for a standard production German SUV

[Mook]

Exactly

[m4ttm4son]

I imagine it's just a marketing piece. They want so showcase their V12 TDi, so they stick it in everything they have that fits. Build a few for TopGear etc to show the AUDI rings on telly pulling two Jumbo jets, and sell the other two to an Arab sheik that gets his kicks pointing at all his amazing cars that no-one else had the mental illness to buy. More TDi TTs sold to hairdressers job done.

[sternocleidomastoid]

Having that much power in something which will be an uninvolving drive is a complete waste imo. As for this engine in an R8 who would buy one? Part of the joy of motoring especially in this sector is the engine noise. I'd take a slower but lovely sounding V8 or V10 over a more powerful oil burner anyday.

[Mook]

Have you heard the noise the Le Mans R10 makes? That V12 is sweet

Interestingly, EVO mag were seriously doubtful about it's ability to handle, but they reckon it handles better than the expected.

A bit like a canal barge with a jumbo jet engine in it...

[tom_hargreaves]

Don't knock it until you've driven it

I've said this before in other threads and it applies more than ever now. It doesn't matter whether it drives well. It's a 100k Audi, it will drive well. But it's irrelevant when you aren't even going to consider buying one. Even if I could afford one of these I wouldn't even consider it, i'd be looking down the 80k Sports car (Porsche 911 GT3, Aston Martin AMV8, Audi R8 etc) route like most other sane people in that financial situation would be. I can honestly say i'd rather have my Z4 over this, and i'm sure everyone else here with the cars they love would rather have their own or the cheaper sports/super cars than this.

Not only the engine noise. Regardless of whether they have the same power, a diesel just isn't as good in a sports car. I would rather have the 4.2 V8 FSI in the R8 than this monstrosity of an engine. There's nothing like a lovely sounding engine in a sports car revving to 7, 8 or 9,000rpm and the satisfaction and excitement that goes with it. Not surging forward in a mass of torque running into the limiter at 4,200rpm.

However as much as I don't want it to, I think the R8 will sell by the shedload with this engine.

I still don't think it'll sell as well as they hope. And I don't think it's a marketing piece for their V12 TDI either, we've seen a frighteningly similar engine in the Touareg and it went down the pan in the mind of a petrolhead faster than a Vietnamese hooker. As woppum mentioned it's the same as it's 50k counterpart but with a V12 diesel. I'd rather have the cheaper version that runs on petrol.

[Mook]

Regardless of whether they have the same power, a diesel just isn't as good in a sports car

Complete bollox.

IMO, of course

You're a BMW nut - drive a 335d for a good day and you won't want a petrol Beemer again for an overall package

[cruiser647]

V12 diesel - great! Surging forward on a wave of torque - great. Bentley style driving with a bit more of a growl and sound.

Nowt wrong with that.

Q7 - not for me.

Stick it in an A8....yes please!

[Dave]

Tom,

I totally agree with you, and yes, I would love to be buying an R8, a GT3 or some other exotic sports car.

The reality is that i have 3 daughters, all of whom are growing into adults too quickly and we need room and space to carry them all and the stuff that goes with that.. for example sports equipment, bikes etc.

The q7 really appeals to people like me and hence i have one on order.

When i had my RS6 i was just like a lot of you on here, were your only criteria is power and handling. I'm at a stage in my life where other points take priority.

[Mook]

we've seen a frighteningly similar engine in the Touareg and it went down the pan in the mind of a petrolhead faster than a Vietnamese hooker.

Holy crap - take a look on Autotrader here - 2 year old ones are going for £18K

Don't panic - it's my work post code, not my home one, so stop trying to subscribe me to Caravanner's Weekly and Sprocket Monthly at my work address

[Mook]

The q7 really appeals to people like me and hence i have one on order.

Dave, have you ordered the V12 TDI, or a slightly smaller engined one?

And was it your birthday present to yourself..?

[Chav]

Tom,

I totally agree with you, and yes, I would love to be buying an R8, a GT3 or some other exotic sports car.

The reality is that i have 3 daughters, all of whom are growing into adults too quickly and we need room and space to carry them all and the stuff that goes with that.. for example sports equipment, bikes etc.

The q7 really appeals to people like me and hence i have one on order.

When i had my RS6 i was just like a lot of you on here, were your only criteria is power and handling. I'm at a stage in my life where other points take priority.

Well in that case, the Q7 is the worst handling big 4x4.

Even the proper RR handles much better, has a bigger boot etc.

X5/X6 handle in a different league. Completely driveable.

The boot space of the Q7 is absolutely dire. How did they make all the space that should be there disappear. Even a RAV4 has a much bigger boot.

As for the braking..... wont go there. Easily the worst test drive of my life.

Like you dave, need practicalities sometimes - but a Q7 has none in my opinion. RR or X5 everytime. Not new either - thats throwing cash away.

You can get a very nice RR or X5 for well under £20k that looks new - most havent done many miles as chelsea tractors.... so great 2nd hand purchases.

I wouldnt touch any of them new.... waste of 20k a year.

[Chav]

With the V12 TDI Q7, the people that mentioned performance not good enough - well you've definitely not driven a powerful modern sooty. Forget the 0-60 in 5.5 seconds - its that slow because of the extra gear change required to reach 62mph, and the 2.5tonne initial mass.

What will blow you away completely is the 30-50 and 30-70 times. Race one in your M3 and you'll look a tit when you get stood on big time. 1000nm of torque is simply mindblowing. In a 2500kg car it'll be whooosh, in a 1800kg car (like R8, A8 etc) it'll be like warp speed.

[theduisbergkid]

Tom,

I totally agree with you, and yes, I would love to be buying an R8, a GT3 or some other exotic sports car.

The reality is that i have 3 daughters, all of whom are growing into adults too quickly and we need room and space to carry them all and the stuff that goes with that.. for example sports equipment, bikes etc.

The q7 really appeals to people like me and hence i have one on order.

When i had my RS6 i was just like a lot of you on here, were your only criteria is power and handling. I'm at a stage in my life where other points take priority.

Dave I didn't realise you had a Q7 on order, I'm interested in why you chose one. I too have 3 growing daughters and a mountain of associated gumph to cart around, I've had a couple of decent Volvos (T5R and then a D5) which I much prefered to an SUV, however I found that they simply got trashed by the kids. Horseriding seems to create more mud inside the car than exists in the bl00dy field for example, so, we got a used Scenic* for carting the family around in which no-one loves and therefore can get abused, I have the BMW for work/fun, and the MX5 for when I'm feeling bi-curious. What does your Q7 do that a decent estate does not ? I test drove a couple of RRs earlier this year and found these was bugger-all room in 'em given the bulk, plus, it drove like a pig. Not tried a Q7 though. How can you financially justify the Q7 new ? It'll be worth £2.50 in 3 years time, less if your kids create the mess mine do

*Please don't tell anyone about the Scenic, I feel dirty and ashamed.

[cruiser647]

We have 3 daughters, and just use the A6 Avant Q for carting our stuff around (with a kiddy seat too).

Eats luggage.

[Soapsuds]

the MX5 for when I'm feeling bi-curious.

I wondered why you are in that all day every day

[Dave]

Dave I didn't realise you had a Q7 on order, I'm interested in why you chose one.

It's an interesting choice even for me.

I've done just about every type of car, and whilst the RS6 Avant was magic it was still compromised in some aspects.

We've loved having the versatility of seven seats in my wife's Toyota Verso and so we wanted something that would give us a lot more room, a bit more luxury and something we could rack up the miles in relative comfort.

The q7 ticks a lot of those boxes... I agree that it doesn't handle like an RS model, or even an S model... but I've done that.. I've had my fun fun driving up the motorway at 130mph+.. and anyway.. with the amount of traffic around nowadays it's difficult to push on.. I'm at a stage in my life where I'm just happy to have something comfortable that we can all fit in with room to move.

Putting my 3 daughters across the back seats is a tight squeeze and it means that one has to sit in the middle which isn't ideal. The Q7 gives them much more room.

Another point i would make is that i had huge misconceptions about the Q7 until I lived with one for a week. Yes, it's big but it's no slouch.. it's build quality is second to none and it has a certain road presence. Add that to the fact that I just don't do BMW. (for whatever reaason)

I have a Q7 4.2tdi S line arriving in a couple of days, with all the boxes ticked.. running on 21" RS4 style alloys

I'll post some picks soon.

[theduisbergkid]

It's an interesting choice even for me.

I've done just about every type of car, and whilst the RS6 Avant was magic it was still compromised in some aspects.

We've loved having the versatility of seven seats in my wife's Toyota Verso and so we wanted something that would give us a lot more room, a bit more luxury and something we could rack up the miles in relative comfort.

The q7 ticks a lot of those boxes... I agree that it doesn't handle like an RS model, or even an S model... but I've done that.. I've had my fun fun driving up the motorway at 130mph+.. and anyway.. with the amount of traffic around nowadays it's difficult to push on.. I'm at a stage in my life where I'm just happy to have something comfortable that we can all fit in with room to move.

Putting my 3 daughters across the back seats is a tight squeeze and it means that one has to sit in the middle which isn't ideal. The Q7 gives them much more room.

Another point i would make is that i had huge misconceptions about the Q7 until I lived with one for a week. Yes, it's big but it's no slouch.. it's build quality is second to none and it has a certain road presence. Add that to the fact that I just don't do BMW. (for whatever reaason)

I have a Q7 4.2tdi S line arriving in a couple of days, with all the boxes ticked.. running on 21" RS4 style alloys

I'll post some picks soon.

Is the Q7 a seven seater then ? Other than this, is it just the 'presense' that it offers over an estate ? I know what you mean about 3 rear seats and shoulder room. Did you consider an XC90 ? Thats about the only one I could stomach myself on account of its praticality and image (or rather, lack of image).

[Mook]

Is the Q7 a seven seater then ?

Yup. There's only the Q7, XC90 and the Merc GL Wagon with 7 (sensible) seats (I think!). IIRC, you can get a 7 seater X5 as well?

Duisberg, just shut the feck up and buy a 7 seater Megane Grand Scenic. Oh, you already did that...

[theduisbergkid]

Yup. There's only the Q7, XC90 and the Merc GL Wagon with 7 (sensible) seats (I think!). IIRC, you can get a 7 seater X5 as well?

Duisberg, just shut the feck up and buy a 7 seater Megane Grand Scenic. Oh, you already did that...

I didn't. Anyway, stop talking about it, its embarrasing enough as it is.

I'm sure the X5 is a 5 seater only.

[Chav]

naf all room in the boot when you're using 3 rows of seats in the Q7. safer to have 3 in the back protected by airbags from the front/sides i thought.

iroad presence is a myth started by people who look up to other people in certain cars isnt it? not convinced the q7 has any "presence" in a positive sense.

Most road "precense" of a car i'd guess is a phantom, but thats in a purely negative way... 99.9% of people look at it and think cock.

no one gets out of the way of a q7. everyone gets out of the way of a lambo....because you know it wont hold you up and you want to listen to it wizz past.

q7 build quality is nice though apart from stupid cd changer which you have to look at all day long.

[tom_hargreaves]

RR or X5 everytime. Not new either - thats throwing cash away.

It's the same situation with most 4x4's. Whether they are brand new or not.

I've drove a 335d loads of times. They are very good but I wouldn't take one over an M car. I'm considering a 335d as the next workhorse. Or the new A4 S Line.

The new X5 is available with a 7 seat option. But you'd need a hack saw to take the legs off anyone over the age of 6 months wanting to sit in them.

Edited October 17, 2008 by tom_hargreaves

[theduisbergkid]

The new X5 is available with a 7 seat option. But you'd need a hack saw to take the head off anyone wanting to buy one.

Fixed your typo there Mr Tom

[Mook]

naf all room in the boot when you're using 3 rows of seats in the Q7.

Maybe Dave doesn't need any room in the boot when he's using 3 rows of seats...

If I had one (I won't but never mind) then it would be a school taxi most of the time, with 6 kids in it (not all mine ), so boot space wouldn't be important all the time.

[tom_hargreaves]

Fixed your typo there Mr Tom

[alera]

It will be like the w12 A8s. The list on mine was over £98k but no one ever paid that for it or any other w12 A8 in the UK I imagine. It was Audi UK mds car, most of the others were tech demonstrators and to limo Celebes around. They were just there as a flag ship model to build prestige for the Audi brand.

I paid £29k for it, was not even 2 years old, had £30k on the clock when I bought it and still had over 3 years left to run on the service and maintenance pack. They also gave me £2k over book on my trade in! Audi were actually proud of the fact you could spec A8s up to £120k+, I actually saw one with a retail of £128k in the Audi motor zone in Berlin a couple of years ago.

Anyway it just goes to show no one will ever pay a £100k for one of these but great to pick up 2 - 3 years down the line for £30k!

These cars are just a brand / prestige building exercise, sticking 2 fingers up to BMW / Merc etc. Quite simply they do it because they can. VAG group spreads the R&D expenditure and the parts bin is shared around all the marques, this engine could end up in the new Phaeton, A8, even Bentley. Porches own half of VAG now as well so I would not be at all surprise in you saw collaboration on the new Cayenne as well moving forward.

Edited October 17, 2008 by alera