jpullen Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 Hi Mook Yes I am, although I left Traffic over 10 years ago, but the standards still apply. There comes a point no matter how urgent the call you are going to where you will not only exceed the capabilities of other road users to see you and react, but your own as well. The difficulty is recongnising when you reach them and then dropping another 10%. I'm sure no one on this forum is a bad driver full stop. But when we step outside our comfort zone things can go wrong very quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drpellypo Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 Agree Shark. The officer only has an exemption when speeding is necessary. He was being a tool - and I expect his punishment in affect will be far worse than what we would have gotten! Anybody who's been in the army and done something wrong will know what I'm talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R32Ash Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 [ QUOTE ] ...and I expect his punishment in affect will be far worse than what we would have gotten! Anybody who's been in the army and done something wrong will know what I'm talking about. [/ QUOTE ] That's not strictly true though is it? If it was one of us, we'd be enjoying porridge for breakfast, for quite a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted March 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 I've done over 160mph in my Rs6 (i'll not say where or when) and i can tell you now that it is fecking fast. The amount of road you are covering is approaching 2.7 miles per minute. The road may have been quiet, but at those speeds anything out of the ordinary would have meant death.. bird on road, debris on road, car pulling out, blown tyre..etc Even in his professional duties i can't imagine him ever having to drive at those speeds, and to let him off "because he has a driving qualification" is outrageous. If it went wrong, it's not him that would be scraping the remains from the carriageways. Personally i think he is a smug little sh1t who is trying his best to wiggle out of something that he shouldn't have been doing. And for his senior officers to be 'helping' him is doing the service no favours at all.It creates an 'us' and 'them' type mentality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpullen Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 You have to remember that 'being used for a police purpose' has a wide meaning and will include training other police officers and that includes using warning instruments purely for training and not in response to a call. Don't think this is done just because we can...it's not. Its a vital and neccasary means of training and not one that I approach lightly. Every day thousands of 'blue light' runs are completed by all the emergancy services, most without any incident at all. You cannot gain the required skill levels on airfields or racetracks. It has to be in the real world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mook Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 [ QUOTE ] But when we step outside our comfort zone things can go wrong very quickly. [/ QUOTE ] I couldn't agree more, which is why I take my car on track-days, where, although it's still possible to have a nasty accident at 130+, everyone is going in the same direction, is aware of everyone around them and the run-off areas are a damned sight bigger than on the motorways. 150+ on the German Autobahns where the limits allow is still feckin scary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golfer Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 [ QUOTE ] If it went wrong, it's not him that would be scraping the remains from the carriageways. Personally i think he is a smug little sh1t who is trying his best to wiggle out of something that he shouldn't have been doing. And for his senior officers to be 'helping' him is doing the service no favours at all.It creates an 'us' and 'them' type mentality. [/ QUOTE ] That just about sums it up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattchaps Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] If it went wrong, it's not him that would be scraping the remains from the carriageways. Personally i think he is a smug little sh1t who is trying his best to wiggle out of something that he shouldn't have been doing. And for his senior officers to be 'helping' him is doing the service no favours at all.It creates an 'us' and 'them' type mentality. [/ QUOTE ] That just about sums it up [/ QUOTE ] I couldn't agree more. Well said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edo Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 [ QUOTE ] Several different things you need to consider here, firstly he was a police officer using the car for a police purpose therefore he was exempt from speed limits. [/ QUOTE ] Rubbish. Where does it say that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edo Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 I guess the big issue comes down to intelligence and application. In the perfect world we would all be "well trained" and understand that there are time when 70 is dangerous on the motorway, and times when 120 is relatively safe.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidicks Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 [ QUOTE ] I've done over 160mph in my Rs6 (i'll not say where or when) [/ QUOTE ] Would that have been through the centre of Probus, Dave? sidicks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted March 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I've done over 160mph in my Rs6 (i'll not say where or when) [/ QUOTE ] Would that have been through the centre of Probus, Dave? [/ QUOTE ] It might have been for 0.3 of a second, but i can't remember Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edo Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 I (alledgedly) did 160 in my E39 M5, felt very stable. Although I wouldnt have wanted to have a blow out of a tyre... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted March 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 [ QUOTE ] I (alledgedly) did 160 in my E39 M5, felt very stable. Although I wouldnt have wanted to have a blow out of a tyre... [/ QUOTE ] yes, i'd agree, but it's not so much the car that is the problem but the rate at which you are covering ground. You have to look so far ahead that it's almost like you are looking at the horizon. Even the slightest bend in the road seems like a right angle... get it wrong at those speeds and you end up looking like this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PinkPrincess Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 I did have Insurance on my car Thats why i was arguing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpullen Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Several different things you need to consider here, firstly he was a police officer using the car for a police purpose therefore he was exempt from speed limits. [/ QUOTE ] Rubbish. Where does it say that? [/ QUOTE ] Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984 Section 87. Exemption of fire brigade, ambulance and police vehicles from speed limits.No statutory provision imposing a speed limit on motor vehicles shall apply to any vehicle on an occasion when it is being used for fire brigade, ambulance or police purposes, if the observance of that provision would be likely to hinder the use of the vehicle for the purpose for which it is being used on that occasion There is a bit more to it, but I will keep it brief for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
330dcoupe Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 I personally think it's disgraceful. Recently a chap was jailed for doing the same sort of speed in a Turbo. Just shows how corrupt and inept our 'justice' system is at times. I swear, If i ever get a court order for doing 100+ then I will hold this and another example in which a police officer was also let off for doing 120 or so - and demand fair justice. I was once pulled by a police officer for "driving too closly to the car in front" - he asked me whether i thought it was a safe distance to follow the car in front. I then asked him why his car was even closer to mine than i was to the person in front - his reply: "I have an advanced driving licence" so i replied "your car will only brake to it's capabilities - so do you think you would have avoided me if I had slammed my breaks on?" - then he accused me of being lippy. you can't win sometimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
330dcoupe Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Several different things you need to consider here, firstly he was a police officer using the car for a police purpose therefore he was exempt from speed limits. [/ QUOTE ] Rubbish. Where does it say that? [/ QUOTE ] Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984 Section 87. Exemption of fire brigade, ambulance and police vehicles from speed limits.No statutory provision imposing a speed limit on motor vehicles shall apply to any vehicle on an occasion when it is being used for fire brigade, ambulance or police purposes, if the observance of that provision would be likely to hinder the use of the vehicle for the purpose for which it is being used on that occasion There is a bit more to it, but I will keep it brief for you. [/ QUOTE ] In an Emergency - was this geezer on an emergency call? and which sort of emergency would need a police officer to do 159mph on any road? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R32Ash Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 [ QUOTE ] He holds a police qualification to drive which has no equivalent in civilan driving and is so well regarded in other countries that some come here for there training. [/ QUOTE ] JimP, Deviating topic a little: Regarding the foreign police driving students that come here, do they get to do public road training here? I mean exceeding speed limits and using 'blues and twos' etc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpullen Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 Thats where you have to make the distinction. These regulations make no mention of 'emergency' It is the purpose to which the vehicle is being put. As you might expect there is a lot of case law surrounding events such as this and it is from case law and not the regulations itself that a lot of decisions are made. As I said before it is not a speed that I would find comfortable but it is important that we understand there is an exemption and this was used on this occasion. The rest was up to two high Court Judges. As for doing the 100+ in your own car to some degree the same applies. Prove the purpose to which it was being put and you have the exemption. For example, taking some one who requires immideate hospital treatment to the nearest hospital and being able to prove no other means was available is using a vehicle for ambulance puposes. The same would apply to a policeman asking you to give him a lift to an incident that required his immideate attendance. If you drove above the speed limit or treated a red traffic light as a give way it would be a police purpose. I know I have simplified what is in reality a complex issue but I'm sure you get the idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagabond Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 [ QUOTE ] I personally think it's disgraceful. Recently a chap was jailed for doing the same sort of speed in a Turbo. Just shows how corrupt and inept our 'justice' system is at times. I swear, If i ever get a court order for doing 100+ then I will hold this and another example in which a police officer was also let off for doing 120 or so - and demand fair justice. I was once pulled by a police officer for "driving too closly to the car in front" - he asked me whether i thought it was a safe distance to follow the car in front. I then asked him why his car was even closer to mine than i was to the person in front - his reply: "I have an advanced driving licence" so i replied "your car will only brake to it's capabilities - so do you think you would have avoided me if I had slammed my breaks on?" - then he accused me of being lippy. you can't win sometimes. [/ QUOTE ] Don't take it too personally, it was probably only because you were driving a beemer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stooH Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 [ QUOTE ] The same would apply to a policeman asking you to give him a lift to an incident that required his immideate attendance. If you drove above the speed limit or treated a red traffic light as a give way it would be a police purpose. [/ QUOTE ] Need a lift? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cris Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 [ QUOTE ] I was once pulled by a police officer for "driving too closly to the car in front" - he asked me whether i thought it was a safe distance to follow the car in front. I then asked him why his car was even closer to mine than i was to the person in front - his reply: "I have an advanced driving licence" so i replied "your car will only brake to it's capabilities - so do you think you would have avoided me if I had slammed my breaks on?" - then he accused me of being lippy. you can't win sometimes. [/ QUOTE ] With the utmost repect to any officers of the law any copper who says he can drive how he wants to because he has an advanced driving course isn't worth arguing with. He is right, you are wrong, end of. I met plenty of people on power trips who are in positions of authority. Just smile and tug the forelock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagabond Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 Aye thats the difference between a egg and a cop...you can beat a egg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpullen Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] He holds a police qualification to drive which has no equivalent in civilan driving and is so well regarded in other countries that some come here for there training. [/ QUOTE ] JimP, Deviating topic a little: Regarding the foreign police driving students that come here, do they get to do public road training here? I mean exceeding speed limits and using 'blues and twos' etc? [/ QUOTE ] Good question, like all the training only the national limits are exceeded, so the 30's,40's etc are stuck to like glue. Which if you have just been overtaken in the national at high speed and then find yourself behind the same car sitting at 30 can seem a little strange. Training isnt given for 'blues and twos' that they can do in their own country. Its all about the ability to drive/ride at sustained high speeds and at the right speed, in the right gear, on the right part of the road at the right time. Speed comes a lot further down the list than Safety. There is many a Japanese or Saudi Arabian police man who now has the taste for a sweet tea and a sausage sandwich having visited one too many road side cafes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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