theduisbergkid Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 I've just had a phone call from a foreign friend, his daughter has come to the UK to study and has rented a flat in Leeds. I did offer to check out the location before they signed on the line, but he was confident it would be OK, the daughter's flat is in Chapeltown... My mate has signed as a guarantor on the 1 year lease, and paid 1 month rent already, the landlord is a company suggested by the Uni but the deal was done direct with the landlord. The area is, acc to them, "hell". The daughter (and 3 friends, they were renting together) have moved elsewhere temporarily but cannot go back to Chapeltown. Taxi's won't go there, there are big drugs problems, and they're basically scared sh*tless. Mateyboy is looking to get out of his obligation to the remaining 11 months. He knows that, contractually, the landlord hasn't done much wrong and that the main fault is they didn't do their homework on the area before signing. However, he mentioned the Landlord has fitted CCTV in the kitchen of the house to keep an eye on the inhabitants (!) which I don't think is right at all. Plus, as he's foreign and lives outside the EU, what are the chances of the landlord pursuing him for the unpaid 11 months ? Ultimately, he only has himself to blame here (and knows it), but if anyone has some practical suggestions as to how this might be resolved I'll pass 'em on and am sure he'd appreciate it. I sure as hell wouldn't want my daughter in the same position. Ta. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patently Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 Ouch. Solicitor*. The camera sounds iffy, but I suspect the outcome if you win is that he has to remove it, not that the whole lease fails. Is it worth talking to the university and embarrassing them into taking on the lease? *I can recommend one if you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m4ttm4son Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 If he's not a UK resident, it'd be pretty hard to chase him for the cash. CCTV sounds dodgy - is there anything in the Tenancy Agreement about it? If he's happy to just disappear, then he'd probably get away with it. How much information does the landlord have on his home address etc? Is his daughter staying in the area? What about the parents' of the other three? Have they acted as guarantor and UK based, if so they will get chased for the 11 months. How will your friend feel about the three parents being liable for his daughter's unpaid rent? (assuming joint and several Tenancy Agreement) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calm Chris Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 Fire bomb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanG Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 I thought all leases had a 6 month break clause in them? Check if it can be sub let.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theduisbergkid Posted September 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 The other 3 are also foreign, but will be in the UK for at least a year, my mate acted as sole guarantor and gave his home address (overseas). The 6 month clause is interesting, I'll check. Patently, I'll see if he wants to go legal, I think he'll just cough up though. Thanks all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mook Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 If he's outside the UK, tell him to tell the landlord to go whistle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewNiceMrMe Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 How was the property described? Could it be classed as having being potentially mis-sold as suitable when it clearly is not? You can rescind a contract on this basis. Furthermore, if the University have recommended him, regardless of the deal being done directly, they do actually have a form of responsibility/liability - in the same way as if you say someone is excellent for job, but know they're ****, you can still be sued. However, I'd simply go to a local solicitor and say "Get me out of this and this is why....". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m4ttm4son Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 If they are all staying for another year, the landlord will be chasing them first. It won't be too difficult to find them. But they can ignore any CCJs if they don't want to stay in the UK in the next few years after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewNiceMrMe Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 This is your area of expertise isn't it Matt? Property rentals etc? If so, and I'm reading it right, you're basically saying you think they're stuffed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m4ttm4son Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 Yep, this is my bag, though don't quote me in court etc Who's stuffed? I don't know the ins and outs of the Tenancy, but trying to get across worse case scenario and what I'd be doing if I were the managing agent. You can't catch 'em all though and once they file for bankruptcy, leave the country etc, you'll never see the money. It could be costly to actually try to argue over legalities of the Tenancy and not pay the "right" way, when it could be easier for all if you do a runner. Make sure you leave the house in a tidy state and if they can rent it again quickly they might not even care too much since they have your deposit to cover any vacant period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eldavo69 Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 Fire bomb Would that not be classed as betterment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calm Chris Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 Would that not be classed as betterment? I was suggesting the house not the whole area, although I could sub contract the work to a Geordie lad that likes to say he is a Yorkshire lad, if someone extended the remitt to the entire city. He'd likely do it for a double saus + egg Mac muff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booster Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 If it is an Assured Shorthold tenancy they can give a month's notice and be off. CCTV totally and utterly against any tenancy agreement as the tenant is entitled to the "quiet enjoyment" of the property and even a landlord's inspection appointment would need to be booked in advance. This is from the small bit of information still stored in my brain from my property management degree circa 1993 so could be outdated and likely to be wrong!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patently Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 There's an argument to say that you just write to the landlord to say you're going, then go. Leave the place tidy, of course. Worst case? You get done for the outstanding rent that you would have had to pay anyway. Lawyers have a tendency to try and make everything perfect and, in the time that takes, you lose out. (The above should not of course be trusted to any extent, is not legal advice, and is from a not-lawyer!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewNiceMrMe Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 I was suggesting the house not the whole area, although I could sub contract the work to a Geordie lad that likes to say he is a Yorkshire lad, if someone extended the remitt to the entire city.He'd likely do it for a double saus + egg Mac muff. Sorry, but I don't do Scum City. I have an exclusion zone that I self administer where that place is concerned. Approximately 30 miles. Any closer and I start to develop severe feelings of anxiety and a need to escape hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theduisbergkid Posted September 11, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 11, 2012 (edited) Thanks for the advice chaps. My mate (despite how it reads) is a decent sort and would like to come to a fair agreement with the landlord, but I think the reality is, this place is a sh*thole and the landlord knows it. The girls will stay in the UK for 1 year and will not want harrassing by debt collectors and legal types, but their Dad (my mate) is overseas, I doubt he'll want the worry of legal action against him though and would probably prefer to cough up... unless there's an easy way out. If anyone is an expert at this, could they drop me a PM ? Mate has sent me the contract and if there's a loophole or flaw in it, it would be nice to know, before going back to the Landlord This doesn't look good; "Ending a tenancy early You may be able to agree with your landlord to end your tenancy early. If you have a fixed-term tenancy (one that runs for a certain period) and there is nothing in the tenancy agreement about ending the tenancy early, you may have to pay your landlord compensation to get out of the contract. The compensation amount could be for the remaining amount of rent left on the tenancy, but may be less if your landlord can find a new tenant before your tenancy was due to run out" From here > Ending a tenancy - private renting : Directgov - Home and community Edited September 11, 2012 by theduisbergkid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booster Posted September 11, 2012 Report Share Posted September 11, 2012 Is the tenancy agreement headed up Assured Shorthold? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theduisbergkid Posted September 11, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 11, 2012 Is the tenancy agreement headed up Assured Shorthold? Yes - "Assured shorthold tenancy agreement. Single room in a shared property". Talk to me, baby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booster Posted September 11, 2012 Report Share Posted September 11, 2012 Then there should be a section about notice periods for either party to end the tenancy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveP Posted September 11, 2012 Report Share Posted September 11, 2012 Is there a lock on the bedroom door? Is it a registered HMO? Does it have all the necessary licences? (I presume it would if it came "reccomended" by the university). If no to any of the above then maybe it is not fully legit (but probably a long shot). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theduisbergkid Posted September 11, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 11, 2012 6.1 Landlord's rights of termination a. The Landlord is entitled to apply for a court order to evict the Tenant and/or any other person at the Property with the Tenant's permission: i. Before or after the end date after serving a notice under section 8 of the Housing Act 1988 and stating one or more of the grounds listed in Schedule 2 of that Act; ii. On the end date after giving the Tenant not less than two months notice under section 21 of the Housing Act 1988, requiring the Tenant to give up possession of the Property on the end date; iii. After the end date and after giving the Tenant not less than two months notice under section 21 of the Housing Act 1988, requiring the Tenant to give up possession of the Property on the day before a Rent Day. b. If the Rent is 14 days or more overdue and the Landlord reasonably believes that the Tenant no longer lives at the Property, and if that is a reasonable belief for the Landlord to hold in the circumstances, the Landlord shall be entitled to enter the Property and take possession of it without first obtaining a court order. 6.2 Tenant's rights of termination a. At the end of the initial fixed term, the Tenant is entitled to terminate this Agreement by vacating the Property and returning the keys to the Landlord on the end date. b. After the end of the initial fixed term, the Tenant is entitled to terminate this Agreement by giving to the Landlord at least one calendar months written notice to expire at any time after the end date. c. Before the end of the initial fixed term, the Tenant is not entitled to terminate this Agreement early unless the Tenant finds a replacement occupier who is reasonably acceptable to the Landlord. The following conditions apply to any early release of the Tenant from this Agreement: i. the Tenant must make payment for, or put right to the Landlord's reasonable satisfaction, all subsisting breaches of the Tenant's Obligations before the replacement occupier moves into the Room; ii. the replacement occupier must sign an agreement in similar terms to this one, for a period lasting at least until the end date; iii. the Tenant must pay the Landlord £50 for preparing a new tenancy agreement and checking the Inventory iv. the Landlord and the Tenant must agree refunds and deductions from the Deposit, and sign the Deposit repayment forms; v. the replacement occupier must pay the Landlord a sum equal to the Deposit, to be held in accordance with the rules of the deposit protection scheme set out in section D of this Agreement 6.3 No refunds if Landlord not at fault If the Tenant vacates the Property before the end date a. the Deposit will be allocated according to the deposit protection scheme rules set out in section D of this Agreement; Page 10 of 16 b. the Landlord has no other obligation to refund any pre-payments made by the Tenant unless the reason the Tenant vacates is because the Landlord is in serious or persistent breach of the Landlord's Obligations in this Agreement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m4ttm4son Posted September 11, 2012 Report Share Posted September 11, 2012 Is there a lock on the bedroom door? Is it a registered HMO? Does it have all the necessary licences? (I presume it would if it came "reccomended" by the university).If no to any of the above then maybe it is not fully legit (but probably a long shot). Universities have different rules for their "recommended" properties. In Canterbury they have to be fully licensed HMOs to get the nod from the University, but many landlords do fine without registering and have perfectly legal and above board Tenancies. Do you know if the Landlord is a local? Some friends of mine had difficulty with a terrible building they were letting and got the council to visit, who promptly condemned it as "Not fit for human habitation". The landlord gave up chasing as he was from oop North. Make pictures are taken when they leave so that any damage cannot be attributed to them if he tries chasing from this route. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveP Posted September 11, 2012 Report Share Posted September 11, 2012 But HMOs generally have to have: licences 60mins burn time between floors fire alarm fire strips on doors etc Chances are these are done, but if not, then a good way to walk away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theduisbergkid Posted September 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 12, 2012 Well, the plot thickens, I've seen some pics and the place is a hell-hole. 25 students in 1 house. No appliances. Cack everywhere. Lanlord has fitted CCTV in most rooms. It's a dump. I've suggested that they photograph the place, return the keys via recorded post, don't leave a forwarding address, and do a flit. My mate is liable for the year's lost rent but I don't think the Landlord knows how to legally pursue my mate overseas for the money. Oh, how much are they being charged for this sh1t-pit ? £1200 a month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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