Milo Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 A mate has asked some advice on the buying a compact 4x4 (think Tiguan, Qashqai size). He tows a jet ski so it needs to drag the ski and itself off the beach/out of sand etc. For that reason, a means of selecting permanent 4 wheel drive is what he needs really. The Qashqais have this function, apparently. It needs to be diesel, used and no more than 2 year old. Budget is quite important, I'm guessing around the £18k mark. Any suggestions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milo Posted March 17, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Oh, and the badge is irrelevant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calm Chris Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Yeti? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milo Posted March 17, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Can they be switched to permanent 4x4 or are they Haldex? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busby Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Sportage? Has the ability to select permanent 4wd 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewNiceMrMe Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Qashqai all the way. Apart from anything else, they hold their money like rocking horse poo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon magnifique Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 New model Forester might be worth a look. They've lost a lot of sales to Kia/Hyundai but they're much better at the off road stuff. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mook Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Can they be switched to permanent 4x4 or are they Haldex? No offence, but what's the obsession with Haldex. It gives AWD. The traction means it switches instantly. I've never ever got stuck in any Haldex equipped VW or Audi - and I used to live properly in the sticks, mud fields etc. Kind of justified why my R32 was always brown over blue Wonder what AWD electronics the Qashqai uses..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milo Posted March 17, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 No offence, but what's the obsession with Haldex. It gives AWD. The traction means it switches instantly. I've never ever got stuck in any Haldex equipped VW or Audi - and I used to live properly in the sticks, mud fields etc. Kind of justified why my R32 was always brown over blue Wonder what AWD electronics the Qashqai uses..? I'm just passing on what his requirements were I asked and he said he's seen some 4WD cars dig themselves into the sand and have 2 wheels effectively useless as they can't get traction, so I presume it sends all the power to the remaining 2, which may or may not be enough to get it going. Hence he wants something that has the ability to switch (if not already have) permanent 4WD. I believe the Qashqai's gadetry has 3 settings - 2WD, Auto, 4WD. The 4WD option apparently continues to distribute the power to all 4 wheels, regardless of whether it detects any wheelspin i.e. if you got 2 wheels bogged down, it would continue to try to drive them, rather than channel the power solely to the other 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milo Posted March 17, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Qashqai all the way. Apart from anything else, they hold their money like rocking horse poo. The problem is, when you're looking to buy used, it works against you. Anything Qashqai seems to be 12 months older than its peers, for his budget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewNiceMrMe Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 The problem is, when you're looking to buy used, it works against you. Anything Qashqai seems to be 12 months older than its peers, for his budget. Indeed, but he has the peace of mind that it'll benefit him when he comes to sell (stating the obvious, I know). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milo Posted March 17, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 You wouldn't like him anyway; he's one of the ones blatting around Cullercoats, getting the locals all uppity! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewNiceMrMe Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Tell the fecker to buy a Ssangyong, new. Also tell him they hold value ridiculously well and are a sub-brand of Rolls Royce. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patently Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 I asked and he said he's seen some 4WD cars dig themselves into the sand and have 2 wheels effectively useless as they can't get traction, so I presume it sends all the power to the remaining 2, which may or may not be enough to get it going. Hence he wants something that has the ability to switch (if not already have) permanent 4WD. I think what he's talking about there is the degree to which the 4WD is controlled by a diff lock (mechanical or electronic) and the manner in which it does it. For example, if you're using a 2WD arrangement with an open diff and one wheel has no grip, the diff will send all the torque to that wheel and you go nowhere slowly. Adding more open diffs to make it a 4WD car will not help at all, because all the torque will still go to the spinning wheel. What you need is some form of diff lock to close them down and make both wheels/all four wheels/both axles/whatever turn at the same rate. That then means you can't go round a corner* but you can get out of the sand. Land Rover just have a lever that you push to lock everything and make all 4 wheels turn together. Simple. Others have cleverererer systems that sense stuff with the ABS sensors and clamp down on a spinning wheel and sort of work in the same way. It's usually the sports-biased 4WD systems that trip up in these situations, for example the 4WD system on my Carrera 4S is up the creek if both the wheels on one side are on slippery stuff, it is the PSM electrickery that will (hopefully) get me out. I have no idea how Hal Dex works, or who he is, so the above is just for general interest. You can wake up now. *without hilarity ensuing 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twinspark Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Dacia Duster, surely? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milo Posted March 17, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 I think what he's talking about there is the degree to which the 4WD is controlled by a diff lock (mechanical or electronic) and the manner in which it does it. For example, if you're using a 2WD arrangement with an open diff and one wheel has no grip, the diff will send all the torque to that wheel and you go nowhere slowly. Adding more open diffs to make it a 4WD car will not help at all, because all the torque will still go to the spinning wheel. What you need is some form of diff lock to close them down and make both wheels/all four wheels/both axles/whatever turn at the same rate. That then means you can't go round a corner* but you can get out of the sand. Land Rover just have a lever that you push to lock everything and make all 4 wheels turn together. Simple. Others have cleverererer systems that sense stuff with the ABS sensors and clamp down on a spinning wheel and sort of work in the same way. It's usually the sports-biased 4WD systems that trip up in these situations, for example the 4WD system on my Carrera 4S is up the creek if both the wheels on one side are on slippery stuff, it is the PSM electrickery that will (hopefully) get me out. I have no idea how Hal Dex works, or who he is, so the above is just for general interest. You can wake up now. *without hilarity ensuing I have 4 wheel drive. It works. That's all I need to know There's precious little room left in my brain as it is 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruiser647 Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Dacia Duster, surely? He's got £18K to spend, not £8K. Although he could probably buy the Duster and some nice watches to cover the depreciation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon magnifique Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Patently has a good point. Diff lock, ideally mechanical. Everything else is irrelevant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patently Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Patently has a good point. Well, it had to happen one day, I suppose. Law of averages and all that. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon magnifique Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 To be honest, if I was looking at the same criteria I'd use the excuse of towing/getting a boat off the beach as justification for a Defender, even though they have all the on road sophistication of a Willy's Jeep and break down all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eldavo69 Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Ain't nuthin' but a G (wagon) thang! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milo Posted March 17, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 A Defender would be perfect, but he's not in a position to be running 2 cars and a Defender wouldn't work as the family car. I think the Sportage ticks all the boxes personally. There are decent 2.0 diesel models on a 63 plate for around £19k. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve2 Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Toyota Rav4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewNiceMrMe Posted March 17, 2014 Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 I've got an idea. Tell him a 5 year old Ssangyong is best, not a new one. However, say you'll do the deal for him. We pay £2k for the car, and split the £16k? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milo Posted March 17, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2014 Toyota Rav4 Again, a good choice Knowing what's he's like about cars, I'd be tempted to go for a Kia, Hyundai or a Forester. I think he'd be better off with something like that as it'll be more car for the money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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