Woppum Posted July 28, 2007 Report Share Posted July 28, 2007 The car was mint. He didn’t know what options it had but had air con which is all that really matters to me and had just under 900 miles on the clock. It is an ex Cyprus car and they have been sitting on it for ‘a number of months’. It was originally up for £70k and they have been gradually reducing it down to the £60k it is now up for. I did ask if there was room for negotiation and his answer was ‘very little’. My guess is if you are paying cash £57k wouldn’t be hard to achieve. When I arrived he first went to have a look at my car. He asked how much I wanted for it and said with all the kit £37k at least. He had never heard of a CSL so had to go off and make a few phone calls and came back with an offer of £28k. I said forget it – if I want the Gt3 id sell it privately – However as it turned out I really didn’t want the Gt3. The car from the outside was stunning. Speed yellow, as clean as a whistle inside and out and the big red brakes looked great on it (which is a surprise as yellow and red are not usually a nice mix!). Inside was a huge disappointment however. The plastics were of a quality I hadn’t been used to since my first Clio – thin and hollow – they look is if they would rattle very easily. The air vents were small and tacky. I think there was very little style or class to the inside of the car. You may say well it’s a Gt3 it isn’t supposed to, but the CSL is miles ahead, and there is no reason for that. The seats were however fantastic, it was the clubsport so had the racers. It again made me realise how poor the CSL seats are. Nice an open at the shoulders and really hugging in all the right places. They looked good too! The testdrive wasn’t great. The salesman made it very clear that there was to be no speeding on the drive as it was under their insurance. However he was helpful as he would arrange a Porsche demo car for me to ragg if I felt the need. I had about 15 minutes in the car I suppose which consisted of a few straights, roundabouts and country roads – most in traffic unfortunately. It wasn’t enough to base real concusions about the car but I could deduce the following: The noise was nothing compared to the CSL with the zorst and cats. It was mechanical, but much much quieter all the way through the rev range. Im sure my car would be too loud for most of you lot but I love it and as I have said before I prefer it to the noise of both the Gallardo and the 430. the Gt3 was never going to win, as stock, in this department. The ride was also much softer than I imagined. No way near as firm as the CSL’s for example and this coupled with the lack of acoustics made the car feel far less sporty than the CSL – that really was a surprise! Apart from the upright seats and the poor interior this car felt to me as I imagined a normal 911 to feel like – not a Gt3! It felt lighter than the CSL – but much vaguer. It wasn’t razor sharp in the handling department. Now I think this is not just down the weightless front end but also the tyres it was wearing. It was on PS2’s and im running cups. However it didn’t feel like a car that could hold its line as well as the CSL in any form of corner. The nose would bob about in high speed corners and any road imperfection would make the steering twitch and jump of course. I think when going for it you would have to be more alert. The CSL is effected by the road surface but not nearly as much. This of course would be something to get used to though. The gearshift was fantastic! A real surprise. I was prepared for this to be the clincher effecting the deal. I thought it would be heavy and too much in traffic or for daily use but this is not the case. The clutch is no heavier than any BMW and the gearshift is the BEST I have used in any car. So precise, I don’t think anyone could miss a gear. Still im not sure that I prefer a manual to SMG? I personally think each cars form of transmition suits it own. I shouldn’t really talk about performance as the car only had 900 miles on the clock and I only got to pull it through second and have a brief spell at third, however there was much less in it than I thought there would be. It was still faster without a doubt but not at all 430 pace. Im sure it would get faster once worn in though. The brakes were shocking. It must have been because the car had never had hard use, but at 900 miles on the clock they shouldn’t have been that bad. There was very little power, and very little servo assistance. They also had no feel. Compared to the AP’s they felt totally puney. Overall I was a bit surprised by the outcome. I thought the Gt3 would not only have held its own but made me think handing over my car and forking out a further £25k would be a bit of a bargain. As it turned out I wouldn’t do a straight swap for the Gt3! The other surprise to me was that the CSL felt like the more expensive car when behind the wheel. The SMG makes it feel for F1, the ride and noise make it feel like a real machine and the interior looks more expensive. The way I like to judge a car is not by its image or ticket price – I like to imagine I have come down from space (probably not a surprise to a lot of you!) and am looking at these 2 machines with no idea about image or price. If I drove both back to back I would come down to the conclusion the CSL was not only the better car but the more expensive one too! People that say the CSL is just a glorified 3 series are not judging it as a car but as a brand and this IMHO is madness. If the new CSL improves upon the current one it will be, to me, easily worth the £70k asking price. Common – tell me im mad! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murzo Posted July 28, 2007 Report Share Posted July 28, 2007 Why not try a 996 GT2. Performance and handling in one package. Theres 2 forsale on PH! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woppum Posted July 28, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 28, 2007 Gt2 really isnt my cup of tea. You can never get a great sound out of a turbo engine, the running costs would be bonkers and I would always be scared of dying. Im not looking to swap now - was just intrested thats all. Will have a go at another Gt3 thats worn in though, possibly a 996RS would be more my cup of tea? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DHA Posted July 29, 2007 Report Share Posted July 29, 2007 I would try and find another wopps, that one has sat for a while if its a 996 with 900 miles on it. The 997 is amazing on the other hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woppum Posted July 29, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2007 I think you need more than 15 munites in the car before you apreciate it. It came out with the CSL and it was the Gt3 that won all the car of the year awards. I need a proper go in another more worn in car I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ari Posted July 29, 2007 Report Share Posted July 29, 2007 That's a great review Wopps, I enjoyed reading that. What comes through most strongly is that for you, the CSL just fits. My Audi Cabrio is like tht for me. I've had a reasonable number of cars, but the A4 Cab just "fits" me, what I want from a car, what it is, how it feels, how it drives, etc. Many years ago I had a Golf GTI MK2 and I felt the same about that. It's no coincidence that I kept both cars longer than any other. I've had the Audi Cab over four years now and have no desire to change it, simply because therre is nothing for the money (or even twice the money, not that I've got it) I'd rather have. Some cars just really do it for you. Sounds like the CSL is that car for you. It'll probably take some beating, just as my Cab will for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woppum Posted July 29, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2007 I think your right Ari. There is nothing I have yet driven which is as sharp, easy and fun. Sounds like its going to be a while before we both swap - whens the new cab out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sayerbloke Posted July 30, 2007 Report Share Posted July 30, 2007 [ QUOTE ] Inside was a huge disappointment however. The plastics were of a quality I hadn’t been used to since my first Clio – thin and hollow – they look is if they would rattle very easily. The air vents were small and tacky. I think there was very little style or class to the inside of the car. [/ QUOTE ] That bad, huh? I don't think you're mad... but then I never was one for buying into the whole "It's a 911 so it must be good" ethos. Good review Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted July 30, 2007 Report Share Posted July 30, 2007 [ QUOTE ] but then I never was one for buying into the whole "It's a 911 so it must be good" ethos. [/ QUOTE ] Me neither, until I drove one. I do agree with Wopps, the car has it's good points and it's bad points, and buying a GT3 to live with daily wouldn't be easy. But the drive is something else. It's difficult to describe, the car just comes together around you, yet you also know that it will bite you if you step out of line. It's almost an adrenaline rush. Some fast cars, and not so much the CSL i must admit, are a bit sterile. My RS6 was fast, but lacked a certain edge. At the end of the day, it's what you want from a car. The RS6 was magic.. fast with 5 up. One of the reasons I haven't got a GT3 is because it might be a compromise too far... two seats, stripped interior, hard ride, wife didn't like bucket seats etc etc.. and could/would i use it for the daily commute? I haven't been able to answer all those questions in my head.. hence why i keep going back and looking at M3/Rs4 type products.. cause they now come so close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sayerbloke Posted July 30, 2007 Report Share Posted July 30, 2007 [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] but then I never was one for buying into the whole "It's a 911 so it must be good" ethos. [/ QUOTE ] Me neither, until I drove one. [/ QUOTE ] I've driven a 996 around Bruntingthorpe and found it just didn't interest me as much as some of the other cars I've driven. On some level, Porsche should be congratulated for managing to make a car that is fast and useable but if I was buying a car like that, I'd want driving it to be more of an event. It just didn't feel special enough to me. Maybe driving a turbo or a GTx model would change that, but at this level of the game, most people are buying because they feel attracted to one brand or another and I'd end up saying Porsches still aren't for me and choosing something else Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted July 30, 2007 Report Share Posted July 30, 2007 That's not good Sam, I'm a bit suprised by some of your findings, but not by others - you've dulled my expectations now! Porsche brakes take some getting used to, they don't feel like they're going to work but they do! You have to get some heat in and push hard! The benefit is that you can really feel what they're doing, you know which wheel is doing what. The interior is the same with all 996's, you can take it apart with your hands. Hence why a lot of people replace the plasic with carbon or painted options, it really does help. The 997 is far more what you'd expect. No wonder they've not sold it if you can't get to drive it properly, the GT3 loves to rev like the CSL so I'm sure it will be more fun when pushed. Ho hum, sounds like you need to keep your 3 series then Cheers Ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woppum Posted July 30, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 30, 2007 [ QUOTE ] That's not good Sam, I'm a bit suprised by some of your findings, but not by others - you've dulled my expectations now! Porsche brakes take some getting used to, they don't feel like they're going to work but they do! You have to get some heat in and push hard! The benefit is that you can really feel what they're doing, you know which wheel is doing what. The interior is the same with all 996's, you can take it apart with your hands. Hence why a lot of people replace the plasic with carbon or painted options, it really does help. The 997 is far more what you'd expect. No wonder they've not sold it if you can't get to drive it properly, the GT3 loves to rev like the CSL so I'm sure it will be more fun when pushed. Ho hum, sounds like you need to keep your 3 series then Cheers Ben [/ QUOTE ] Haha! I think when it comes down to these 2 its each to their own. Im sure if I was currently driving a C2 - I wouldnt find the steering odd and its all a matter of getting used to. Yup - will keep the 3 series for the moment. Ill drive the new M3 and probably not take it, wait for the new CSL - possibly decide its to big? - then look at a 997 Gt3? The world is an oyster and these arnt bad decisions to make Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian_m Posted July 30, 2007 Report Share Posted July 30, 2007 Would you REALLY get 37k for the CSL??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Posted July 30, 2007 Report Share Posted July 30, 2007 [ QUOTE ] Gt2 really isnt my cup of tea. You can never get a great sound out of a turbo engine, the running costs would be bonkers and I would always be scared of dying. [/ QUOTE ] Wopps, I feckin love that quote. I would always be scared of dying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riz Posted July 30, 2007 Report Share Posted July 30, 2007 [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Gt2 really isnt my cup of tea. You can never get a great sound out of a turbo engine, the running costs would be bonkers and I would always be scared of dying. [/ QUOTE ] Wopps, I feckin love that quote. I would always be scared of dying [/ QUOTE ] Riz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gizze Posted August 1, 2007 Report Share Posted August 1, 2007 [ QUOTE ] Would you REALLY get 37k for the CSL??? [/ QUOTE ] I am sure if he parted out the bits it would be pretty close, I think he would need to put the original radio back in the car and put the original exhaust etc. back on. The brakes would add to the value imho and would be worth staying on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian_m Posted August 1, 2007 Report Share Posted August 1, 2007 taking it apart yes, but he was saying as a trade in!! NO WAY would you get 37k for the car as is IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woppum Posted August 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2007 No not as a trade in. I new he couldnt offer me what I would get on Piston Heads so just quoted that. If he was stupid enough to match it so much easier for me if I wanted to swap! I am not sure I would have to revert back to normal: £3.5k on nav and sounds £2.6k on zorst - cats will count doubt the rest would £3k on brakes - worth probably £2k to the right customer? Its a specilist car. There are only 422 about forgetting all the written off ones. Without the bits it would be what £35k? Only £2k for all the above I dont think sounds alot. Still dosent really matter as I aint selling it for less than double that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gizze Posted August 2, 2007 Report Share Posted August 2, 2007 I think the non oem nav would put a lot of people off, but there is always someone that may be thinking about adding a system that would like it, and the exhaust would not put people off as such, but wouldn't add any value, but would get you maybe £1200 used, so that would be worth taking off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woppum Posted August 2, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 2, 2007 I think once people see the quality of the after market sat nav it would suddly become worth it. Still I aint selling! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted August 2, 2007 Report Share Posted August 2, 2007 Plus you would have to unpaint the wheels ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woppum Posted August 2, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 2, 2007 [ QUOTE ] Plus you would have to unpaint the wheels ... [/ QUOTE ] Adds value IMHO. The amount of looks the car get with the blk wheels and red brakes... I suppose they could hate it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon magnifique Posted August 2, 2007 Report Share Posted August 2, 2007 When it comes to trade-in values, mods never add value to a car. If anything, they knock value off. However expensive they were. Granted, you may find a private buyer with the same taste who's willing to pay over the odds. Hypothetical if you're not selling though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woppum Posted August 2, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 2, 2007 [ QUOTE ] When it comes to trade-in values, mods never add value to a car. If anything, they knock value off. However expensive they were. Granted, you may find a private buyer with the same taste who's willing to pay over the odds. Hypothetical if you're not selling though. [/ QUOTE ] Yup, never going to happen. My point is its a CSL and there aint many around. I think these add ons would be enought to ask for the slight premium. Not that it matters! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DHA Posted August 4, 2007 Report Share Posted August 4, 2007 Woppum I think the fact that you own it may command a premium Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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