Soulboy

Forums & Max Power sorts

30 posts in this topic

I don't get the obsession on (most) car forums with constantly chasing power gains.

Give someone a brand new car.....with X00 bhp and which will do 0-60 in under 5 seconds....and the first thing a lot of forum members want to do is stick a load of things onto it to make it go faster, even at the expense of the warranty and invalidating their insurance.

So I ask myself 'why?'

If you want something faster, why didn't you buy something faster as standard?

And how fast do you want to go? I probably use max power on my cars about 0.00001% of the time. Why would you risk a warranty and insurance for increasing that?

I am sure if they got a Veyron, the first thing they would do is see if you can get it remapped, or stick a performance box and new air filter on it or something.

And a carbon fibre fuel flap.

But I think I have the answer. I am just getting old?

I think this maybe the younger generation - who grew up with the likes of the Saxo VTR and stuck big exhausts etc on them, to try and steal a few more HP than their mates. And so they are just carrying on doing what they have always done. Not really realising that they now drive something with plenty of performance out the box.

Or am I a mentalist and the only person on a car forum who thinks this way....and should get a Nissan Micra and a hat?

 

Edited by Soulboy
Amended

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Don't forget the pipe & slippers 'pops!

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I understand two modifications:

1.  If they want to make the car sound better.  However, even then it is not something I've pursued.

2.  If they want to make it drive more smoothly with better power delivery (I had the Z4 35i remapped and new air induction fitted).

The Z4 wasn't new though.  I know of one car that was heavily modified in a very tacky way from new.  It included wrapping the keyfob in imitation carbon fibre film - and this wasn't a cheap car either.  An array of other mods were made, all of which combined to make a nice car look absolutely awful.

That said, if the owner likes it, so be it.

Their money to waste and all that. +++

p.s. SoulBoy - I agree in general.

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Modding the car doesn't have to invalidate your insurance. You just advise them and pay a bit more. Sometime the fuel consumption improvements can cover the cost.

 

With regards warranties - increasing the performance of the car doesn't mean you've no warranty. It just means if your change causes an issue then you can't claim for that under warranty. Seems fair to me.

Exhausts and remaps often improve sound, drivability, performance (some massively), economy etc etc plus give pub bragging rights and can surprise people on the road.

The great thing is that it's not compulsory to do so if you're not a fan then simply don't.

My personal mindset is tweaking a car often makes sense due to the small investment for some big returns. When it comes to spending silly money on it then I do think why not just buy a better car. Some of course just like to be individual and that's fine too. All the "kids" spending every penny they have on their max power motors means there's less going on drugs etc. Seems preferential to me.

 

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I think modifying your daily driver is usually akin to ruining it. The more I've modified my Twbo for track days, the more of an event it is to drive - but if it was my daily driver it'd get very boring very quickly having my fillings rattled out. 

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The Z4 drove more smoothly and the power increase was substantial.  I wanted something to keep me remotely interested in an otherwise awful car.  The modifications did so.

MPG stayed around the same.  

Insurance went up about 20% but that was to be expected when you go from circa. 305 hp to 374 hp.  I was happier to pay that than to change almost immediately upon buying the car and lose a good £3-4k in all likelihood.  Holding on for 18 months meant that I didn't lose a great deal more than that (well, a bit more, but nothing that made me cringe).  

If you tell your insurers and pick and choose your mods carefully, I think they're a good way of maintaining interest or dramatically improving a car.

Bodywork changes, carbon where it doesn't belong, spoilers that you don't need and probably slow you down, etc., they're stupid (on all but track cars such as the Twbo that eldavo has).

I always go back to the point on my original post though - as long as it is their money and their choice, I don't really care.  If they're uninsured or it is my money, I would have a rather different view! +++

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Spoilers that slow you down, hmmm I'm saying nothing. 

 

(I may or may not have bought a 968 Turbo RS carbon adjustable spoiler as a Xmas present to self - it goes from standard to full-on airbrake depending upon the track/car balance)

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I get the posts above. But us lot on here aren't typical of the brand forum members - who I am mainly talking about. And who I have some issues with;

I see people on the forums getting brand new cars on cheap finance deals and immediately trying to screw as much power as possible out of the car with mods.

They then don't tell the insurer because they can't afford the extra premium, or become uninsurable.

They have whole threads about how you can get away with a warranty claim by removing the mods when the turbo/gearbox/other item fails (even the mod installation companies join in on these). They should have a thread about hacking the manufacturers bank and taking the money to pay for it. Same thing - fraud.

Lastly, they then remove everything and get rid of the car. And the next owner has no idea until the gearbox/turbo/whatever fails. With no warranty and a huge bill. 

The cheap finance deals are the issue I suppose. Allowing people to get high spec cars who would previously have had a cheap second hand car.

I have got an interesting story on a failed gearbox on my old 2nd hand GTI 16v many years ago.....

20160725_202126.jpg

Edited by Soulboy
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Yes, I get that (the new car modders on forums) and I agree with everything you say.

I suspect, but have no proof of this, that there is a very high number of people who don't declare the modifications to insurers.

Hopefully that will come back to haunt them instead of anyone else.

You make a good point about future owners too.  I guess that comes back to the old adage of 'caveat emptor'.

There is something else that bothers me.  Brakes.  They're always the last thing most of the modders you're talking about will look at.  They don't see them as important and think power, power and more power is all that matters - not the ability to stop.  I thought very carefully about changing the discs on the 35i but instead opted for fast road pads.  I don't really class that as a mod (it is, and I did tell the insurers but they didn't seem too interested in all honesty) but I felt that even though the 35i brakes were very good I needed to give myself a little extra piece of mind.  If anything, I only changed for brake fade avoidance.  Discs would have been something I would have changed if I'd gone beyond 400 hp (although that would have been difficult without a major turbo mod or cam changes).

Unfortunately, a lot of people don't even consider them.  They're expensive for a start (beyond pads).  

Take your average Golf TDi.  Often modded, as we all know.  You can get a huge increase in power and I'm afraid the brakes on the car are not the same as those on a car designed for performance from the outset (one that will absorb more power through a decent braking system from the outset).  Add 30-40% power to one of those, leave the brakes as standard and you're going to be in a hell of a lot of trouble one day.

You could get the power increase for well under £1,000.  Then you go looking at how much the brakes will cost and it is a lot more - so the modders don't bother. Instead they'll go for the wheels, tyres, spoilers, stereo system and so on.

Look at any mainstream car forum for the cars with modifications and then see how many of them have brake upgrades.  You'll be able to count them on one hand.

Edited by NewNiceMrMe

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Whilst I get spending a few quid to get the power of a car probably too expensive to buy outright, I really don't understand spending more than the car is worth on mods. 

Of course a Euromillions win and my subsequent purchase of an AM Vantage packed off to Works for a complete modernisation overhaul would make me quite the hypocrite! I look forward to being in that position. 

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I quite agree with you NNMM, however with lots of "mainstream" cars there is often quite an easy brake upgrade that is often up to the task.

eg. 

BMW E36 with e46 330 discs & calipers.

R53 Mini Cooper S with R56 Cooper S calipers & discs.

Both offer a larger pad area, a larger disc diameter and therefore around 20/25% increase in braking force.

Quite often when you look there are comparable gains within other mainstream manufacturers, the above 2 examples will run at around £300 using good quality pattern parts.

 

EFA - Fronts only that is.

Edited by E-bmw

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Personally, I thoroughly enjoyed my modding experience (mkv gti back in the day). Found it very addictive. The additional performance was reward enough, however the sheer desire to add something that would be beneficial to eek out another possible bhp, was all-consuming almost. Whether or not it did add 'power' the fact that it possibly would was all I needed. As I say, an addiction really.

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Didn't 5th Gear do a thing a few years ago where they took the same car and applied different mods to it and compared lap times?

Pretty sure it was them and the result were that a day's driver training, followed by better tyres led to quicker lap times than a mild power bump or new suspension. 

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It was with Suzy Perry driving (forget the car) on 5th gear, quite right.

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What brakes are you silly peoples talking of?

Most of these forums I've seen or visited only talk of their 'breaks'. 

Not at great length though. :rolleyes:

Edited by S3Bangs
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I've never not modified a car I've owned - I think it's more about making more your own over what the factory decided it should be.  I've even modified my VW van and Shark will get hold of it shortly to crank some sensible horsepower and, more importantly torque out of it.

Why?

Because I can. Simple as that.

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On 12/17/2016 at 11:33 AM, Andrew said:

Whilst I get spending a few quid to get the power of a car probably too expensive to buy outright, I really don't understand spending more than the car is worth on mods. 

Of course a Euromillions win and my subsequent purchase of an AM Vantage packed off to Works for a complete modernisation overhaul would make me quite the hypocrite! I look forward to being in that position. 

There's good reason my track toy is called the "Million Pound Golf" :grin:

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3 hours ago, Mook said:

There's good reason my track toy is called the "Million Pound Golf" :grin:

What? You mean the Mookswagen Gti?

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I think we are forgetting the age factor. 

TSN 10+ years ago had many more threads regarding modifications to cars. 

As we age we become less interested/inclined to fettle. Plus the fact we can usually afford to buy a better product in the first place. 

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That's very true.

However, the most modded and chavved up (from new) Audi I know of belongs to a guy of very similar age to me! :roflmao: 

Edited by NewNiceMrMe

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1 hour ago, billy2shots said:

As we age we become less interested/inclined to fettle. Plus the fact we can usually afford to buy a better product in the first place. 

No, no, no, no. It just means we can spend more on modding a more expensive toy :grin:

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2 hours ago, NewNiceMrMe said:

That's very true.

However, the most modded and chavved up (from new) Audi I know of belongs to a guy of very similar age to me! :roflmao: 

Not to mention the owner of a certain red GTI...

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56 minutes ago, Mook said:

No, no, no, no. It just means we can spend more on modding a more expensive toy :grin:

There will always be some big kids. 

Growing old in mandatory. Growing up is optional. 

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On 19/12/2016 at 6:11 PM, Cuprabob said:

Not to mention the owner of a certain red GTI...

Those DRLs were for safety....not to make it look good remember?

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