Torino101 Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 A 355 was about 70k?and yes I'd have one over a 135 too Think they ranged from £83k to £103k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woppum Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 100k fully specced you mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torino101 Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 Think the final variant F1 sold from '98 to '99 was £100k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woppum Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 My step brother had an f1. You sure? going to have to google now, it's warping my fragile little mind... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashleywater Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 The RS3, in Harris's opinion, was beaten hands down by a £10k cheaper car. What's the problem with that? No problem with that at all, what I have a problem with, is the way certain elements of the test were pure and unadulterated bull, and as I have said previously when he makes comments about pressing the sport button causing the cars ride to get ridiculously hard, is just plain hilarious as on the RS3 it has no actual effect on the suspension setting, so it is like WTF is this chump talking about? Besides which I cant be arsed with Car Journos full stop. whatever they think is the "flavour" of the year, I appreciate they have a story to write and if they want to bend facts to accomodate their "theme" who cares? In regards to a 355 there are some nice ones about at not silly money,was looking at this car strangely enough a few months back, still have not discounted having one in the garage, as the coxster has long gone, anybody have an idea on things to look out for when purchasing a 355? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimdiesel Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 I have gone Audi, Audi, Audi, BMW, BMW, Audi in recent years (the last 3 Audis, quattro) and know which I prefer. It is actually very close, but on balance I prefer Audi's way of doing things. Thats why I am off to possibly order an M135i on Saturday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian_C Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 Estoril? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimdiesel Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 Mineral with Coral. I would rather blend in, than stand out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruiser647 Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 Besides which I cant be arsed with Car Journos full stop. whatever they think is the "flavour" of the year, I wholeheartedly agree! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gizze Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 Besides which I cant be arsed with Car Journos full stop. whatever they think is the "flavour" of the year, But hasn't this been going on for the last 20 years? When I started getting into cars was only 20 years ago and all the journos always put the BMW in front, I bought into Audi. Then after a while I decided to try a BMW, and realised that journos the world over may have actually had a point. Don't get me wrong I like my Audis still, as a family wagon with 4wd they do some things very well, but I would never be stupid enough to think that when it comes to really enjoying driving they would ever come close to a BMW. It me be 'flavour of the year' but it has been every year for as long as I can remember with one exception, when the RS4 came out and the E46 M3 was still currrent. Audi then had a year when the journos were praising them, I rememeber it now 'This is the new Audi' we all cried, wait till the A5 arrives, the new A4 etc. etc. But no, Audi went back to making cars that the Audi customer wants and knows them for. I do think Audi need to move with the times in many ways, most buy their cars despite the handling, if they got that right they would grab a load more business from other marques. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimdiesel Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 This is a very good point. Audi is a very successful business so why should it change its approach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gizze Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 This is a very good point. Audi is a very successful business so why should it change its approach. They don't dare change, they are doing well, why change. I do think if they did they would increase sales, but why risk it. A few years ago Audi never even saw BMW as their competition, they saw their rivals as VW and Volvo, I think that says a lot about where they have come from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewNiceMrMe Posted October 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 Oh without doubt, they're never going to jeopardise the number one priority - commercial success. Their products makes a huge amount of money. Mind you, reviews like this will not help them - because if they produce another car that is £4k, £6k or £10k more than another than is seen to beat it in reviews....you can be sure their revenues will tumble. I don't anticipate that happening though. It's just a point to consider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scillyisles Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 I guess the difference is summed up by the description of the Audi being a car for the destination whereas the BMW is a car for the journey. I am rather fortunate in that I have multiple cars in my fleet to take the choice of on a daily basis and last Saturday had to do a trip up to Yorkshire (there and back in a day) with four bags of luggage and four passengers. Two of the car choices I had were RS3 or BMW M3 CSL. Both would have fitted the luggage in just and both will carry 4 passengers (okay the BMW is more cramped in the back but is comparable to a 1 Series) I chose the RS3 and it handled the journey in it's stride with no issues. What did however strike me on the way back was how secure it felt coming back during the night as it had been raining heavily. As I came round the M25 the road was very wet with standing water in the lorry grooves etc etc. In these conditions, the RS3 excels whereas the CSL (which is not running on Cups) would have been a very edgy drive. Both are great cars but for day to day practicality in the sort of conditions we get in the UK on our congested and heavily policed roads, the Audi is an attractive proposition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian_C Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 I do think Audi need to move with the times in many ways, most buy their cars despite the handling, if they got that right they would grab a load more business from other marques. Adding to this Gizze, I hate the way manufacturers such as Audi are putting bigger and bigger tyres on. Its the old chesnut of handling over grip. 20s on an S5 or [the new] S6 is just stupid. 20s on an S5 gives you no sidewall whatsoever. Last month I sourced an A4 Avant 2.0 TDi 170 quattro for my auntie, finding a recent S line wearing 18s not 19s was bloody hard work! Picking up a set of 17s for her tomorrow too. However, stick bigger wheels on and it lowers the 0-30 time and increases the lateral cornering grip, decreasing the laptime, which is why manufacturers do it I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 19's on mine purely for the looks. Dynamic suspension for the choice of how it rides. S-line's run "Sports Suspension" as standard and I found it quite fidgety and then when pushing on it wallowed. The biggest down side to big wheels is the increase is unsprung weight .... but with the use it gets it's hardly an issue. Horses for courses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewNiceMrMe Posted October 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 I guess the difference is summed up by the description of the Audi being a car for the destination whereas the BMW is a car for the journey. I am rather fortunate in that I have multiple cars in my fleet to take the choice of on a daily basis and last Saturday had to do a trip up to Yorkshire (there and back in a day) with four bags of luggage and four passengers. Two of the car choices I had were RS3 or BMW M3 CSL. Both would have fitted the luggage in just and both will carry 4 passengers (okay the BMW is more cramped in the back but is comparable to a 1 Series)I chose the RS3 and it handled the journey in it's stride with no issues. What did however strike me on the way back was how secure it felt coming back during the night as it had been raining heavily. As I came round the M25 the road was very wet with standing water in the lorry grooves etc etc. In these conditions, the RS3 excels whereas the CSL (which is not running on Cups) would have been a very edgy drive. Both are great cars but for day to day practicality in the sort of conditions we get in the UK on our congested and heavily policed roads, the Audi is an attractive proposition. ..and I wouldn't argue with any of that. I get that completely. You answered my question within the body of your post too. Before I got to the part where you said "not running on Cups" it was going to be my question. However, I'd endorse completely the fact that a 4WD RS3 in very wet conditions is going to feel more stable than an M3 CSL - and it would have been my choice under those circumstances too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian_C Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 (edited) However, I'd endorse completely the fact that a 4WD RS3 in very wet conditions is going to feel more stable than an M3 CSL - and it would have been my choice under those circumstances too. Wow I must have missed on the news that hell had frozen over!?! You'll be buying winter wheels next!!! :p Edited October 23, 2012 by Ian_C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewNiceMrMe Posted October 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 Totally different scenario as well you know. If you have a choice of two cars, and one is a track-honed performance car with RWD, and the other is a 4WD hot hatch, it's entirely different to putting winter tyres on a car that simply doesn't need them 364 days of the year.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashleywater Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 But hasn't this been going on for the last 20 years? When I started getting into cars was only 20 years ago and all the journos always put the BMW in front, I bought into Audi. Then after a while I decided to try a BMW, and realised that journos the world over may have actually had a point. Don't get me wrong I like my Audis still, as a family wagon with 4wd they do some things very well, but I would never be stupid enough to think that when it comes to really enjoying driving they would ever come close to a BMW. See I dont actually disagree with at all with the "Driver" enjoyment thing, but you really do have to see this from the perspective of what the customer wants, on an overall day to day basis. I fondly remember my 2.8 Capri as being the best overall driver experience I have had in a RWD car, followed closely by my 1760 RS Mexico and subsequent Pinto engined stage 3 transplant, no unsprung weight worth a fag paper,no ABS no driver aids just raw fun, and numerous "Choccy Starfish" moments to boot. Move on a couple of decades and does a present day Beemer give me the same RWD "Driving" experience.....? In a word "No" All I am looking for and want is, a practical nifty performance A-B Car for everyday use 365 days a year, so 4WD is now a major attraction for me, so if BMW start making a 4WD performance hatch (Which does not look like a 1 series) then sure I would be interested, but right now they dont. The thing is as I have stated previously, Car Journos opinions mean zilch for me, as the only opinion that matters is mine when it comes to purchasing the car of my choice. I am the SMF who has to live with that choice, are all these CJ's going to refund my money if I am p1ssed off with the thing after a couple of weeks, as I only bought it on the basis of their "Personal" recommendation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garcon magnifique Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 Some good points here. Which do I personally prefer between Audi and BMW? BMW, these days by some distance although that hasn't always been the case. (It was the case before I bought a Beemer though! ) Does that mean I think Audi should change? Hell no! What's the point in them trying to mimic BMW? As has been said, they're highly successful doing what they do, and crowded though the market might be they manage to distinguish themselves from BMW, Merc and Jag - in fact I think we're fortunate that those four manufacturers have, over time, developed their own unique way of doing things. Higher up the model line we can add Porsche to that too. All distinctive if you know what you're looking for in a car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewNiceMrMe Posted October 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 I don't think Audi need to change - they just need to up their game and realise that's what BMW have done. The BM interiors weren't good enough. They were good, but not for what you paid. Now they are. All Audi need in my opinion is realise that you can surely have all the benefits of AWD with a bit more feedback. They don't need to change their recipe - just tinker with it a little. It won't change the overall taste. It'll just make it more palatable. By the way, please don't anyone think BMW have tricked me into thinking they're now producing bargain priced cars. They're not, far from it. The M135i looks like a very rare exception - whereas the rest of the range is still ludicrously priced in my view. Look at nearly new BMW prices compared to new. They're all dropping mountains of money because that's when they're finding their real price point in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gizze Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 Adding to this Gizze, I hate the way manufacturers such as Audi are putting bigger and bigger tyres on. Its the old chesnut of handling over grip. 20s on an S5 or [the new] S6 is just stupid. 20s on an S5 gives you no sidewall whatsoever. Last month I sourced an A4 Avant 2.0 TDi 170 quattro for my auntie, finding a recent S line wearing 18s not 19s was bloody hard work! Picking up a set of 17s for her tomorrow too.However, stick bigger wheels on and it lowers the 0-30 time and increases the lateral cornering grip, decreasing the laptime, which is why manufacturers do it I guess. My god, have you been stalking me!!?? I was saying only this the other day on the Merc forum, someone mentioned that the new A Class AMG looked like it had undersize wheels, a few of us said that maybe Merc realised that a wheel with some decent tyre on it might actually make the car handle and feel better. They are all guilty of this, my M3 on 18s was so much better than on 19s, the only car I have owned that was better on bigger wheels was the CSL. I had an A6 S-Line on 18's for 2 days and that was superb, so much nicer than the saloon on 19's (or maybe 20's as it was horrid?) that I had driven just before. My E350 estate was on 17s and that was lovely, again so much nicer than the coupe on 19s I tested first. I actually think the cars on 17's and 18's look more purposeful now as well, those on 20's just make me think 'all show and no go'. I have probably come across a bit 'anti-Audi' in previous posts, I am not, if I could have any car right now I would go for an A6 avant, or even allroad, bi-turbo. It just suits what I want from a car right now so much better than anything else, I just can't afford one. I have had a new F11 Touring, I have had the current S212 E350 cdi estate, and I have to admit that the Audi beats them both, it gets the handling, comfort and overall feel good factor nailed better than either of the others, however, when I took the S6 out it really, really disappointed. All about expectations I guess? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gizze Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 Look at nearly new BMW prices compared to new. They're all dropping mountains of money because that's when they're finding their real price point in my opinion. Totally agree, it is amazing how much you can save on a nearly new car at the moment, and that shows what the public really think they are worth. Was looking at a new 320d sport auto with Nav for a neighbour, it was £33k new after discount, however, 6 month old ones with better spec could be had for £24k. That is 30% depreciation in 6 months, that to me says that it is over priced by at least 20% new. Same with the A6, I really wanted to order an A6 Avant, the bi-turbo diesel with a few options sounded like a car I could stick with for 5 years, but it is silly money. It was £60,000 after discount, and many of the options where just things I was used to on the Mercedes E350. I have attached a spec sheet, I had to delete loads of options like TV tuner, HUD etc. etc. to get it back under £70,000, which seems an awful lot of money for a family diesel estate. But then I guess cars are getting cheap in real terms, we all want everything for nothing. My old man paid £38,000 for his E320 back in 1993, we paid £37,000 for our house that same year, that house sold for £210,000 recently and in the same year I paid £35k for a new E350. Cars are cheap as chips really, we want a new Mercedes/Audi/BMW for £400 a month. I remember being wowed when seeing a Merc or BMW on the road growing up, today they are just the norm. gizzesA6avant.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woppum Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 ..and I wouldn't argue with any of that. I get that completely.You answered my question within the body of your post too. Before I got to the part where you said "not running on Cups" it was going to be my question. However, I'd endorse completely the fact that a 4WD RS3 in very wet conditions is going to feel more stable than an M3 CSL - and it would have been my choice under those circumstances too. Each to their own, cups in the snow were great fun - sideways for the total duration of a blank Notting hill high street one morning on the way to work was rather exciting! YouTube - M3 CSL stuck in the snow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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